AudioNervosa

Electro Stimulation Ward => Signals and Noise => Topic started by: S Clark on April 29, 2018, 05:02:38 PM

Title: What speaker cables are you using, what did they replace, and why?
Post by: S Clark on April 29, 2018, 05:02:38 PM
Been listening to cables for a few weeks.  Electra Cables, Straley Reality, Audioquest CV8, and Bolder.  There are clear differences. 
What's in your system, what did they replace, and why?
Title: Re: What speaker cables are you using, what did they replace, and why?
Post by: richidoo on April 29, 2018, 08:49:51 PM
I replaced Anticables with JPS SuperConductor3. They have great resolution, great bass control, but the best attribute is they don't ring like copper cables. They use a conductor alloy that stops the ringing. They are silent, no ringing at all. The tone sounds richer and more intense, and I like the way the lack of ringing affects the music, and affects me when I listen. JPS makes budget cables too, like UltraConductor2. They all have the same non-ringing alloy conductor, pricier versions have more resolution and better bass response and bass control.
Title: Re: What speaker cables are you using, what did they replace, and why?
Post by: Nick B on April 29, 2018, 10:05:59 PM
I replaced Anticables with JPS SuperConductor3. They have great resolution, great bass control, but the best attribute is they don't ring like copper cables. They use a conductor alloy that stops the ringing. They are silent, no ringing at all. The tone sounds richer and more intense, and I like the way the lack of ringing affects the music, and affects me when I listen. JPS makes budget cables too, like UltraConductor2. They all have the same non-ringing alloy conductor, pricier versions have more resolution and better bass response and bass control.

Rich,
Can you elaborate on what constitutes ringing? How is that pereceived in the musical presentation?
Also, if copper ďringsĒ, have you found that silver does the same?
Nick
Title: Re: What speaker cables are you using, what did they replace, and why?
Post by: Nick B on April 29, 2018, 10:09:06 PM
Iím using Garyís (aka gander) solid copper braided cables. They replaced the Straleys which I had and enjoyed for many years.
Title: Re: What speaker cables are you using, what did they replace, and why?
Post by: richidoo on April 29, 2018, 11:39:47 PM
It's like reverb, but more subtle. It's inside the music, not laid on top like reverb. I think people think it's in the recording, the actual sound of the instrument. It's a sound we are all accustomed to, so we don't notice it until it's gone. I have read that silver also rings, but less noticeable, but this may be the cause of the silver fear many audiophiles have - too much detail, tizzy, etc.
Title: Re: What speaker cables are you using, what did they replace, and why?
Post by: rollo on May 08, 2018, 08:01:05 AM
One size does not fit all. I use depending on components TWL, Belden and Tchernov. Price matters as well. Tough call. Just need to try as many as you can .
I prefer a neutral cable however sometimes a little color is needed. What that is called synergy.

charles
Title: Re: What speaker cables are you using, what did they replace, and why?
Post by: dflee on May 08, 2018, 03:08:54 PM
Being able to only afford one set of cables, I did as much reading as I could and got the TWL. I was happy with the pc and read good things about the sc. Before that was a pair I've had for quite some time. Can't remember if it had a specific name but were Harmonic Tech in-wall cable. Even though they weren't in the wall it was the same wire without the pretty cover.
Title: Re: What speaker cables are you using, what did they replace, and why?
Post by: BobM on May 08, 2018, 04:36:16 PM
This is going to sound like heresy to some cable people, but before you look to upgrade your speaker cables I think you need to optomize your interconnects. Those signals are much smaller and have a higher chance of getting corrupted by RFi and EMI, hence shielded or not.

Then worry about your speaker cables.

I used Jon Rich's Belden 89259 cross connect DIY design for many years and was very happy with them. I tried others but there was little to no improvement, sometimes worse sounding to my ears, so I stuck with what I had. Then I tried Pete's speaker cables (Triode Wire Labs) and finally found something that improved things without breaking the bank. Truth - I was seriously looking at used Nordost Heimdall cables at that point but couldn't pull the trigger for the cost.  No, I didn't compare Pete's cables to the Heimdall's, but I can say I'm completely satisfied and have lost the urge to look elsewhere.
Title: Re: What speaker cables are you using, what did they replace, and why?
Post by: S Clark on May 08, 2018, 06:08:36 PM
Point taken.  But in my case, speaker cables were the last thing to be upgraded, having found quality interconnects and power cables that I'm pleased with. 
Title: Re: What speaker cables are you using, what did they replace, and why?
Post by: steve on November 26, 2018, 09:27:27 PM
I replaced stranded wire with 10 parallel 18 gauge solid wires simply because it reduces
inductance to nill while I kept the capacitance to absolute minimum.

I am also able to select the total gauge for maximum musical pleasure. Too small of total gauge and
too large total gauge degrades the sound in my system.

Sounds fantastic, and don't want to spend a fortune purchasing 6n pure wire to check for even
better sonics.

cheers

steve
Title: Re: What speaker cables are you using, what did they replace, and why?
Post by: mikeeastman on November 28, 2018, 06:58:38 AM
I replace Audioquest cv-8 with Mapleshade Double Helix V.2, 1/3 the price and better SQ
Title: Re: What speaker cables are you using, what did they replace, and why?
Post by: jimbones on November 28, 2018, 09:29:14 AM
Uh Oh here we go.....Lol. :duh
Well I just dumped big bucks into a pair of MIT Matrix HD38. I already upgraded every other cable in my system. Like Bob says go interconnects first.
Title: Re: What speaker cables are you using, what did they replace, and why?
Post by: Nick B on November 28, 2018, 10:33:09 AM
Uh Oh here we go.....Lol. :duh
Well I just dumped big bucks into a pair of MIT Matrix HD38. I already upgraded every other cable in my system. Like Bob says go interconnects first.

Well, I just looked up your MITís and yes, theyíre a bit more than I can afford 😀
Are they broken it yet? Like what you hear?
Title: Re: What speaker cables are you using, what did they replace, and why?
Post by: pumpkinman on November 28, 2018, 02:59:39 PM
I use Van den Hul M.C. D 352

https://www.vandenhul.com/product/the-d-352-hybrid-halogen-free/
Title: Re: What speaker cables are you using, what did they replace, and why?
Post by: jimbones on November 28, 2018, 05:31:29 PM
Uh Oh here we go.....Lol. :duh
Well I just dumped big bucks into a pair of MIT Matrix HD38. I already upgraded every other cable in my system. Like Bob says go interconnects first.

Well, I just looked up your MITís and yes, theyíre a bit more than I can afford 😀
Are they broken it yet? Like what you hear?

Just ordered them last week wonít get them until Monday
Title: Re: What speaker cables are you using, what did they replace, and why?
Post by: malloy on November 29, 2018, 10:32:06 PM
I've gone from Monster :lol:, to Van den Hul clearwaters, to XLO's, to Kimber 8tcs, Ixos 606 silver and copper stranded, and finally to 47 Lab OTA stratos solid cores.

Monster simply sounded 'not right'. The Van de Hul's sounded dull, The XLO's were too bright after an amp upgrade. The 8tc's were ok but sounded veiled compared to the Ixos. The OTA beat everyone of them in terms of bass, clarity, tone, and detail.

I've been wanting to try some anti-cables, DNM reson, or goertz for the past few years now, but decided to get other better gear instead.  Has anyone tried Clear Day cables?
Title: Re: What speaker cables are you using, what did they replace, and why?
Post by: Nick B on November 29, 2018, 11:41:33 PM
Hadnít heard of them until your post. Seems like the price is just as reasonable as the Audio Envy cables I posted about recently. Iím intrigued with both. Let us know if you pull the trigger.
Title: Re: What speaker cables are you using, what did they replace, and why?
Post by: TomS on November 30, 2018, 05:31:53 PM
Belden Iconoclast SPTPC speaker cables, which are now assembled and sold by Blue Jeans Cable. They replaced WireWorld Silver Eclipse which replaced DH Labs Q-10 Signatures.

It is very hard to say just one thing that improved as they are simply better all across the board, but bass/mid-bass clarity and tone, as well as cymbal brush work are quite amazing. You get complete clarity, but they retain a sense of ease that just seems very natural compared to the others.

It's also interesting that each pair comes with hand measured L, R, and C values. The designer is very transparent about his process and the exact science of what goes into the cables.
Title: Re: What speaker cables are you using, what did they replace, and why?
Post by: Nick B on November 30, 2018, 06:12:16 PM
Belden Iconoclast SPTPC speaker cables, which are now assembled and sold by Blue Jeans Cable. They replaced WireWorld Silver Eclipse which replaced DH Labs Q-10 Signatures.

It is very hard to say just one thing that improved as they are simply better all across the board, but bass/mid-bass clarity and tone, as well as cymbal brush work are quite amazing. You get complete clarity, but they retain a sense of ease that just seems very natural compared to the others.

It's also interesting that each pair comes with hand measured L, R, and C values. The designer is very transparent about his process and the exact science of what goes into the cables.

Didnít see the SPTPC on the Blue Jeans site. Are they there?
Nick
Title: Re: What speaker cables are you using, what did they replace, and why?
Post by: TomS on November 30, 2018, 06:34:55 PM
Belden Iconoclast SPTPC speaker cables, which are now assembled and sold by Blue Jeans Cable. They replaced WireWorld Silver Eclipse which replaced DH Labs Q-10 Signatures.

It is very hard to say just one thing that improved as they are simply better all across the board, but bass/mid-bass clarity and tone, as well as cymbal brush work are quite amazing. You get complete clarity, but they retain a sense of ease that just seems very natural compared to the others.

It's also interesting that each pair comes with hand measured L, R, and C values. The designer is very transparent about his process and the exact science of what goes into the cables.

Didnít see the SPTPC on the Blue Jeans site. Are they there?
Nick
There is a pull down on the "Cable Stock" field with 3 wire types

http://www.iconoclastcable.com/speaker/index.htm (http://www.iconoclastcable.com/speaker/index.htm)
Title: Re: What speaker cables are you using, what did they replace, and why?
Post by: Folsom on November 30, 2018, 07:02:44 PM
I use 4S11. It is the best sounding of different DIY things I have tried. At this point I assume there is something wrong with a stereo if 4S11 isnít good enough. But I admit the JPS makes me slightly curious.
Title: Re: What speaker cables are you using, what did they replace, and why?
Post by: Jack on November 30, 2018, 07:17:59 PM
Currently back to the ones from TWL as they are the best fit with this pair of speakers.
Title: Re: What speaker cables are you using, what did they replace, and why?
Post by: malloy on November 30, 2018, 09:23:54 PM
Hadnít heard of them until your post. Seems like the price is just as reasonable as the Audio Envy cables I posted about recently. Iím intrigued with both. Let us know if you pull the trigger.

Hmmm. Haven't heard of Audio Envy until now. I didn't want to be sucked into making any cable changes again.  :lol: But I am looking at their RCA's. Are these Eichmann bullet plugs? Good price.

http://audioenvy.com/product/home-car-pro-interconnects/nv-4s-pr-rca/

Title: Re: What speaker cables are you using, what did they replace, and why?
Post by: Nick B on November 30, 2018, 11:30:32 PM
Hadnít heard of them until your post. Seems like the price is just as reasonable as the Audio Envy cables I posted about recently. Iím intrigued with both. Let us know if you pull the trigger.

Hmmm. Haven't heard of Audio Envy until now. I didn't want to be sucked into making any cable changes again.  :lol: But I am looking at their RCA's. Are these Eichmann bullet plugs? Good price.

http://audioenvy.com/product/home-car-pro-interconnects/nv-4s-pr-rca/

They look like Eichmanns to me ...apparently now called ETI  http://www.eti-research.com.au
Yes, great pricing. As Charles met the AE designer, maybe heíll have a bit more info next time he checks in.  Would love to try some stuff again soon. Garyís cables are quite good, but ya never know
Title: Re: What speaker cables are you using, what did they replace, and why?
Post by: etcarroll on December 01, 2018, 10:22:57 AM
I switched to bi-wiring when I switched to Supra Rondo 4 x 4.0 mm2, nice improvement though I never knew if it was from the cable or bi-wiring.

After speaking with Mr Vandersteen earlier this month I'm now in the hunt for Audioquest bi-wires. I'd love to buy a set of Rocket 88s, but too expensive. So I'm tracking older Audioquest products online waiting for a deal that I can't pass up.
Title: Re: What speaker cables are you using, what did they replace, and why?
Post by: malloy on December 02, 2018, 01:36:20 PM
I switched to bi-wiring when I switched to Supra Rondo 4 x 4.0 mm2, nice improvement though I never knew if it was from the cable or bi-wiring.

After speaking with Mr Vandersteen earlier this month I'm now in the hunt for Audioquest bi-wires. I'd love to buy a set of Rocket 88s, but too expensive. So I'm tracking older Audioquest products online waiting for a deal that I can't pass up.

Interesting and good prices, too! I use their LoRad power cables that look exactly like these blue jackets and internal wires.

Supposedly the flagship Sword line is very, very good but out of my price range.  https://www.tnt-audio.com/accessories/sword-rondo_e.html
Title: Re: What speaker cables are you using, what did they replace, and why?
Post by: gander on December 04, 2018, 01:11:43 PM
Iím using Garyís (aka gander) solid copper braided cables. They replaced the Straleys which I had and enjoyed for many years.

Glad you like them.   :D
Title: Re: What speaker cables are you using, what did they replace, and why?
Post by: gander on December 04, 2018, 01:16:17 PM
It's like reverb, but more subtle. It's inside the music, not laid on top like reverb. I think people think it's in the recording, the actual sound of the instrument. It's a sound we are all accustomed to, so we don't notice it until it's gone. I have read that silver also rings, but less noticeable, but this may be the cause of the silver fear many audiophiles have - too much detail, tizzy, etc.

Do you have links to articles about ringing because of copper, etc?
Title: Re: What speaker cables are you using, what did they replace, and why?
Post by: gander on December 04, 2018, 07:02:28 PM
OK I'll throw this out there.

Over about the past 6 months I have found that insulation on wire actually dulls the sound. Yup, it does, to some degree.

My latest DIY power cords (with PC bare wires soaked in grapene), digital IC, analog ICs, speaker wires and speaker internal wires all use a special type of bare copper wire separated from each other with a special material, creating mostly an air dielectric. The result is a much lower capacitance cable (50 pF per 4-foot 10 ga power cord, 29 pF per 4-foot IC, measured with a capacitance meter) and sound has really opened up using this approach.

Could it be that the sound artifacts you are talking about are to some degree not because of the wire itself, but the insulation on the wire?  Since we have been using insulated wire from day 1, could it be that insulation was assumed to be sonically transparent when it is actually not? 

If so, then just about all the cables you buy that use insulated wire has this problem.

Hmmmmmm... pondering...

Gary


Title: Re: What speaker cables are you using, what did they replace, and why?
Post by: P.I. on December 04, 2018, 07:57:18 PM
OK I'll throw this out there.

Over about the past 6 months I have found that insulation on wire actually dulls the sound. Yup, it does, to some degree.

My latest DIY power cords (with PC bare wires soaked in grapene), digital IC, analog ICs, speaker wires and speaker internal wires all use a special type of bare copper wire separated from each other with a special material, creating mostly an air dielectric. The result is a much lower capacitance cable (50 pF per 4-foot 10 ga power cord, 29 pF per 4-foot IC, measured with a capacitance meter) and sound has really opened up using this approach.

Could it be that the sound artifacts you are talking about are to some degree not because of the wire itself, but the insulation on the wire?  Since we have been using insulated wire from day 1, could it be that insulation was assumed to be sonically transparent when it is actually not? 

If so, then just about all the cables you buy that use insulated wire has this problem.

Hmmmmmm... pondering...

Gary
Dielectric absorption and attendant ringing (smear) is a well known problem.  That is one of the reason that the cables I build have had organic fiber insulators and cores for the last 10 years..  not a mystery here, just physics.
Title: Re: What speaker cables are you using, what did they replace, and why?
Post by: steve on April 29, 2019, 02:23:55 PM
And the gauge of wire makes a sonic difference, even down to 0,2 of a gauge or less. I would suggest doing a comparison of gauges when auditioning and using the results as a reference. If the larger sounds better, continue with even larger. If the smaller sounds better, continue with smaller. There will be an optimum gauge for one's system. This works for paralleling wires as well.

Do a comparison of materials as well, such as copper or silver. I would still keep track of the gauge, as jumping from one brand to another without knowing the gauges simply becomes a crap shoot.

cheers

steve
Title: Re: What speaker cables are you using, what did they replace, and why?
Post by: James Edward on April 29, 2019, 03:13:16 PM
I donít have the discipline of most here; so take my findings with a few grains of salt... I also have 22 and 25 foot runs of speaker cable, which makes it $difficult$ to audition a lot of Ďaudiophileí cable.
I like the results with Anti-Cables standard 12 gauge wire. I guess it falls into the less insulated category of wire.
Title: Re: What speaker cables are you using, what did they replace, and why?
Post by: mauidan on April 29, 2019, 06:46:04 PM
I'm currently using Audience Front Row speaker cables.

They replaced Audience Au24 SX cables.

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