Author Topic: Saying no to magic?  (Read 4234 times)

Offline ampdesigner333

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Saying no to magic?
« on: December 17, 2012, 11:47:10 AM »
Some companies are selling "magic" devices they say to put between your amp and speakers to "fix" the sound that speaker cables make.  The circuit inside is a big secret, line the recipe for Kentucky fried chicken.

I'm not a big fan of any such "magic" device, mostly because of the sales pitch.  There's no such thing as magic.  Sorry, I'm a scientist. Our amps are designed to drive *speakers* accurately. Anything between the amp and speaker (except some wire) is not only unnecessary but bound to have negative effects.

Are they trying to say amplifier designers don't understand the properties of wire?  Don't they make amplifiers themselves (in the case of <company name withheld>)?  Does their crappy amp need a bandaid (ha ha)?

Whenever they start talking about quantum physics and audio together, they're probably pulling a fast one. I don't mean to be harsh, but I hate seeing good honest people get scammed.

Some distortion is pleasing to some people. This is why some prefer the sound of old tube amps.  They create nice sounding distortion. My view on this is that if I'm going to condition the audio signal in any way, I'll do it at the source (before amplification) because it makes better sense to have a back end that reproduces what you give it accurately.  Distortion can't be "undone".  I like the option of removing it before it gets in.

If you want to eliminate the issues with speaker cables, you should buy a pair of Cherry MONOs and put them right next to the speakers.  The signals should be brought in over shielded balanced cables (cancels common mode noise).

We have a pair of DEMO faceless Cherry MONOs and DEMO Black Cherry MONO ULTRAs.

We've been building almost all mono amps lately....     

Hope this was not too shocking and perhaps a bit enlightening.  We believe in treating the customer right and creating real value based on quality engineering.  No "magic".  Thanks, and happy holidays!

-Tommy O
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Offline Face

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Re: Saying no to magic?
« Reply #1 on: December 17, 2012, 02:22:59 PM »
If you're referring to MIT's boxes(or networks), there's no magic inside.  They're full of impedance correction networks and/or zobels.  In some rigs they can sound ok and can enhance the soundstage and imaging, but can sound awful and over artificial in others...

Offline mdconnelly

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Re: Saying no to magic?
« Reply #2 on: December 17, 2012, 06:46:43 PM »
I'll bite... what's the difference between Cherry Monos and Black Cherry Monos?  I understand the diff between Monos, Pluses and Ultras but hadn't seen reference to 'Black Cherry' before.

Offline JBryan

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Re: Saying no to magic?
« Reply #3 on: December 18, 2012, 09:00:15 AM »
Perhaps in the audio world, this 'magic' simply means something that has not been properly measured or quantified.

Being a scientist sometimes doesn't help in that it often creates questions that have no way of being answered. I've read white papers and theses where the questions bumped up against the instruments' inability to measure the proper data.

For instance, most everyone agrees that the human threshold for hearing is @20kHz yet I've read that if a tone is played within that threshold and an even or odd-order harmonic of that tone, well above the threshold is added, we can perceive a difference. If played by itself the upper harmonic tone can not be heard yet when played with the lower tone, a difference is detected between the pair and the original single tone. The author attempted to explain that while we can not hear the upper harmonic, we can perceive its effect on the original tone's vibration in our ear. The problem was that he had to leave the numbers behind in his explanation because there were no instruments that could measure the nuanced effect of these harmonics on the human ear. Without hard numbers, his conclusion was considered more conjecture than theory...yet the phenomena itself was properly evidenced and documented therefore, it wasn't disputed - just the cause.

Along the same vein, you mentioned that many folks enjoy listening to music through tube amps even though the amps tend to have higher distortion numbers than their SS counterparts. Having had many SS and tubed amps run through my system over the years, I've come to prefer the tube sound - particularly SET, in spite of its inherently high distortion compared to the other topologies. Aside from the other factors, I believe I can tolerate, even enjoy higher levels of even-order harmonic distortion associated with SET amps while the odd-order distortion eventually becomes tiresome and grates on me a bit, even at much lower levels.

I'm sure its mostly a matter of personal preference but I equate the odd/even distortions with bitter and sugary taste. I much prefer the taste of sugar to say, bitter coffee and will tolerate an overly sweet dish to one that has even a hint of bitterness. Of course, other folks may have the opposite preference..its all good.
« Last Edit: December 18, 2012, 09:04:36 AM by JBryan »

Offline richidoo

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Re: Saying no to magic?
« Reply #4 on: December 18, 2012, 11:21:02 AM »
Nicely said, JBryan

Offline Carlman

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Re: Saying no to magic?
« Reply #5 on: December 18, 2012, 01:07:58 PM »
We need evidence because we don't want to decide what's best for ourselves.
I really enjoy listening to music.

Offline ampdesigner333

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Re: Saying no to magic?
« Reply #6 on: December 22, 2012, 11:00:57 AM »
I'll bite... what's the difference between Cherry Monos and Black Cherry Monos?  I understand the diff between Monos, Pluses and Ultras but hadn't seen reference to 'Black Cherry' before.

By "Black Cherry MONO ULTRAs", I mean Cherry MONO ULTRAs with black faceplates.  Thanks.
Digital Amplifier Company
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Offline richidoo

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Re: Saying no to magic?
« Reply #7 on: December 22, 2012, 03:39:21 PM »
Mmmm, I like black cherry soda... I wonder if they still make that? My Grandma who used to stock up on it for me (35 years ago) recently passed on. No more black cherry soda for me.
But maybe a black cherry amplifier?? :D

Offline rollo

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Re: Saying no to magic?
« Reply #8 on: December 24, 2012, 07:15:10 AM »
Mmmm, I like black cherry soda... I wonder if they still make that? My Grandma who used to stock up on it for me (35 years ago) recently passed on. No more black cherry soda for me.
But maybe a black cherry amplifier?? :D

  Sorry for your loss. Hey ya never know.


charles
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