AudioNervosa
Systemic Development => Analog Devices => Topic started by: bpape on February 27, 2020, 08:56:39 PM
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Been exclusively streaming for quite a while now from a server. Getting back in to vinyl. Have a VPI HW19 Mk II, RB300 with new weight and incognito rewire, table came with a VDH MM-1 with a new stylus. Looking for a phono stage and would love some advice from those who have been into this. Need to keep it under $700 and used is just fine. Things I am considering (but welcome to other suggestions!)
IFI iPhono2
Hagerman Cornet 3
Graham Slee ???
Lehman Black Cube
Musical Surroundings Phonomena II
Vincent PHO 701
Vista Audio
Lounge Audio.
Would be nice to have a combo MM/MC unit but as of now, just MM is fine and then either upgrade or add a step up transformer later if I move to a low output MC. Kind of depends on how the Van den Hul sounds. Have not heard this cartridge.
Thanks in advance for all opinions.
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Vista has a very good reputation, especially on their phono stages. Couldn’t readily find a price, but I think it’s around $400.
http://www.vista-audio.com/products/phono-2/index.htm
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Vista Phono 2 in that price range without a doubt. I owned the Phono I Mk II and the the Phono 2 for the last three. If you need help or service Boris is as good as it gets. If you decide to go higher in budget the Gold Note PH-10.
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I currently have two Vistas, a Jolida, a Dodd, and a Graham Slee. The Vistas are excellent value but at the bottom of the group. I think the Dodd and Graham Slee are both a good step up... Dodd with better base and more musical, the Graham Slee with more detail. But I think the Jolida is my favorite.
The Dodd is the priciest... and probably impossible to find. The Vistas are the cheapest, And used Graham Slees and Jolidas are quite afforable and regularly available.
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For the money Vista. Just needs a better power supply to be its best.
charles
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Thanks for the input. I'll add Tavish to the list. People seem to just love it and it sounds like what I'm looking for - thoughts?
Charles, anything special on the power supply?
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I have owned the Vista. Excellent for the $$.
I currently own the Tavish Vintage 6SL7, JuicyMusic Tercel Mk2, and Blue Circle BC27-pi. All can be had used in the 500 to 700 dollar range. All handle both MM and MC. I recommend all these units without hesitation.
The Juicy might be a bit tough to find now that Mark Dineen is no longer in the game. A few years ago I'd see them fairly frequently on the used markets, but I think guys have figured out just how good they are and are holding onto them. Same thing with the JM preamps (Blueberry, Peach and Merlin). I also own the Blueberry Xtreme.
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Thanks for the input. I'll add Tavish to the list. People seem to just love it and it sounds like what I'm looking for - thoughts?
Charles, anything special on the power supply?
Brian just any good linear supply.
charles
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Thanks all. Tried to look at the Juicy Music but looks like the site has been hacked. Can't get anywhere and antivirus flagged a redirect virus. Got any deeper links or contact info?
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JM is out of business so new is not possible. Used is the only option.
Go to the Klipsch forum, the guys over there love the JM stuff. On that board I see more posts discussing it and FS ads than anywhere else.
Search on "juicy music" (with the quotes) and 33 pages returns, including some recent FS ads.
Mark (JM designer / builder) used to post over there frequently under the name "mdeneen" but somehow all his posts have disappeared.....wiped clean....only hint of his existence is follow-up posts quoting his posts. I'm not familiar with that board so I don't know how that happens.
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PJL Electronics I hear is good
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ADDENDUM: For anyone interested, AudioKarma is another site with a fair bit of chatter about JM gear.....17 pages worth.
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I don't know if this is even relevant at this point, but I had the Juicy Music Blueberry Extreme, and I loved the sound. It's another one of those pieces that, with money, space, foresight, etc., etc., I would have held on to. Such is life...
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I don't know if this is even relevant at this point, but I had the Juicy Music Blueberry Extreme, and I loved the sound. It's another one of those pieces that, with money, space, foresight, etc., etc., I would have held on to. Such is life...
I bought one of the early first run Blueberrys waaay back in 2004..... I think?
Of course, there's always something better....got antsy....sold it....missed it......corrected my mistake by buying a used Blueberry Xtreme 2. Before Mark disappeared from the scene I had him do all the mods he was offering. Last summer my tech had to repair something in the voltage regulation circuit. Apart from that, trouble free.
Enjoyed the BB so much several years ago I felt confident in picking up a used Tercel 2 phono stage. Still have it and enjoy it very much. But this too needed a repair over the summer (power supply).
You still see JM gear available FS, mainly on those 2 sites I mentioned earlier. But they are aging now and might start breaking down.
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Brian, stop fooling around. :) Check out the Audio Hungary Qualiton Phono stage. A tubed affair with outboard SS power supply. You can get an a Biz to Biz price.
I have one and it changed my world. I used a State of the Art Loesch & Weisner tubed phono for years. no longer. www.audiohungary.com
charles
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Still a bit out of my league but thanks for the suggestion.
Any opinions on the Moon products? I've always liked the sound of their stuff overall.
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this looks interesting, if a bit unconventional. but. i'd want a 30 day trial listen...
http://parksaudiollc.com (http://parksaudiollc.com)
https://www.tnt-audio.com/ampli/parks_audio_puffin_e.html (https://www.tnt-audio.com/ampli/parks_audio_puffin_e.html)
note the reviewer said it gave up nothing to his two 3-times more expensive phono stages he normally uses.
and, i might want to wait a while, based on the email exchange i had w/mr parks - upgrade will be in the works soon:
q (moi):
hi!
interesting product!
a couple of questions:
- when are you going to include the spdif function as a factory option - at the same 96khz speed as the internal dac? (easy enough mod, but who wants 48khz when 96khz is there?)
- when are you going to go to 192khz (or higher; and also for the spdif out?)?
- when are you going to have a socket for the op-amp(s?) to allow for easy op-amp rolling?
thanks!
doug s.
(tho it appears that if you don't wanna do the easy spdif out mod, you can now get it already done for $100)
a (mr parks):
Thanks for the email, Doug. Happy to answer your questions:
- Hope to switch the 48kHz to 96kHz this fall. This will require a factory mod for in-service units, though the DIY mod at 48kHz will remain an option for those, too.
- No plans for leaving 96/24 at this time. Part of this is leaving the hardware alone as much as possible to focus on software development. Have some firmware upgrades coming this August (free for all Puffin owners) that will add some revolutionary functionality. The other part is that 96/24 is a sweet spot engineering-wise: solves the Nyquist and aliasing issues that 44.1kHz and 48kHz had, but permits much better (and efficient) DSP of the audio frequency band. This latter engineering bonus just isn't a part of the equation for those using digital as a transport mechanism only.
- No plans for a DIP socket.
Warm Regards,
Shannon Parks
www.parksaudiollc.com
doug s.
Yes, unconventional and quite interesting. Thanks, Doug
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I'd try to buy a Salas phonostage. They come up for sale once in awhile.
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I'm not saying to build it yourself.
You'd need a vastly bigger budget to find something like most of the builds.
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Nice, already took a look!
It's feedbackless in a better way than PS Audio's new flagship phono. You can roll some nice caps, and most people use some good ones. It's got a bit of a following.
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Interesting piece - but... Not sure why I would be going to analog only to have my phono pre convert to digital then back to analog???
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If your looking for a mm phono stage check out the Decware ZP3. All tube, all point to point wiring. I had one for years. Loved it. $1300 new. Lifetime warranty. Decware is rarely mentioned but they know what they are doing. The real deal.
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Bummer. I've had similar experiences. But the guy didn't lie to me. He was just wrong.
steve deckert left a bad taste in my mouth quite a few years back, when he blatantly lied to me about how one of his low powered amps would do driving my hi-efficiency - but 14 ohm - speakers. he said it would be great. it totally sucked - full gain on my preamp wouldn't drive the 97db-efficient speakers to decent volume levels. and i had two other 4wpc amps that would drive you out of the room if you got anywhere near full gain.
i'd rather not patronize decware. if you find something used, at 25% of retail, then maybe it'd be worth a try...
ymmv,
doug s.
If your looking for a mm phono stage check out the Decware ZP3. All tube, all point to point wiring. I had one for years. Loved it. $1300 new. Lifetime warranty. Decware is rarely mentioned but they know what they are doing. The real deal.
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I don't know. Im pretty sure he is self taught which infers certain limitations. People function within the box defined by their understanding. For most folks, not much exists outside of that. I was thinking that he could have wound you a tranny with 16 ohm taps. My only Decware product was the ZP3 which was wonderful. But I do truly love my 20/20. Maybe I should have recommended a Sutherland KC Vibe, $895 or Insight $1400. Ron Sutherlands engineering chops are of a known and respected quality.
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Doug, I had a similar experience with a company that shall remain nameless. I had a question about the upper limit frequency range of their subs and when they told me I was suspicious. This was critical as the low end response of my OB speakers was limited. But because it was his sub I drank the kool aid. Sure enough it was now where close to what was i was told. Look, you have to sell and buyer beware.
well... in my case, i probably should have known better. but his explanation sounded plausible.
his 4w amp was rated at 4 ohms. i doubted it could drive my 14 ohm speakers very well, even tho rated 97db/1w. (and my speakers were actively crossed over to subs at 80hz, making it an even easier load for an amp.) he assured me that, tho his amp was rated at 4 ohms, that was to let folks know it could drive more difficult loads, and that it would be fine driving an easier load.
was he just wrong, or was he lying? and, if he was wrong, what does that say about his engineering skills? you be the judge.
doug s.
Bummer. I've had similar experiences. But the guy didn't lie to me. He was just wrong.
steve deckert left a bad taste in my mouth quite a few years back, when he blatantly lied to me about how one of his low powered amps would do driving my hi-efficiency - but 14 ohm - speakers. he said it would be great. it totally sucked - full gain on my preamp wouldn't drive the 97db-efficient speakers to decent volume levels. and i had two other 4wpc amps that would drive you out of the room if you got anywhere near full gain.
i'd rather not patronize decware. if you find something used, at 25% of retail, then maybe it'd be worth a try...
ymmv,
doug s.
If your looking for a mm phono stage check out the Decware ZP3. All tube, all point to point wiring. I had one for years. Loved it. $1300 new. Lifetime warranty. Decware is rarely mentioned but they know what they are doing. The real deal.