Author Topic: Fuses  (Read 4619 times)

Offline Emil

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Fuses
« on: February 20, 2010, 07:00:41 AM »

Anyone play with either the Hi-Fi tuning or Furetech fuses?

At 40 bucks each it seem worth a try. Anyone compare the two?
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Offline rollo

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Re: Fuses
« Reply #1 on: February 20, 2010, 08:01:03 AM »

Anyone play with either the Hi-Fi tuning or Furetech fuses?

At 40 bucks each it seem worth a try. Anyone compare the two?

   Although, I have not made the plunge all who have to my knowledge say it made a small difference. For the good but small. Cleaning the fuse socket and fuse was a similar effect. "The weak link" is a great marketing tool.  :duh


charles
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AlanMaher

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Re: Fuses
« Reply #2 on: February 20, 2010, 08:16:20 AM »
I like the Furutech fuses.

shep

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fuses
« Reply #3 on: February 20, 2010, 08:26:00 AM »
There is a discussion about this on AC. Apparently "Acme" make just as good for far less.

Offline Emil

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Re: Fuses
« Reply #4 on: February 20, 2010, 09:34:57 AM »
"The weakest link"

Does seem to make sense. we spend money on dedicated lines and powercords all going thru a fuse.

I know the difference a fuse can make when i bypassed the fuse completely on my Maggie 1.6s.

So Rollo
"small but good change"
40 bucks worth at least? :D
"Today I didn't even have to use my A.K.
I got to say it was a good day"
    --Ice Cube

Offline mfsoa

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Re: Fuses
« Reply #5 on: February 20, 2010, 10:27:34 AM »
I had a HiFi in my VAC amp and thought it was an improvement.

Until a power tube went, and took my $40 fuse with it   :(

Off to Rat Shack and that's what's till in there now.

-Mike

Offline rollo

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Re: Fuses
« Reply #6 on: February 23, 2010, 08:00:41 AM »
"The weakest link"

Does seem to make sense. we spend money on dedicated lines and powercords all going thru a fuse.

I know the difference a fuse can make when i bypassed the fuse completely on my Maggie 1.6s.

So Rollo
"small but good change"
40 bucks worth at least? :D

  After cleaning the fuse socket and fuse ends IMO the difference was to small to warrant $40 each. Now if ya wanna spend it go for it. BTW no fuse is better than any fuse. Not safe but sounds better as you have experienced with the Maggies.


charles
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Offline richidoo

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Re: Fuses
« Reply #7 on: February 23, 2010, 09:23:19 PM »
After cleaning the fuse socket and fuse ends IMO the difference was to small to warrant $40 each.

I was thinking a dab of silver contact enhancer pudding on each end should do most of what the silver fuse element is doing without the cost, although the goo isn't cheap either, but it goes a lot farther and does more tricks.  Anyone ever try that stuff on fuse?

Offline tmazz

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Re: Fuses
« Reply #8 on: February 24, 2010, 07:56:18 AM »

BTW no fuse is better than any fuse. Not safe but sounds better as you have experienced with the Maggies.

I had an eye opening experience with fuses "back in the day". My initial foray into this insanity that we call high end came in the mid-80s when I bought a pair of Dahlquist DQ-10s while on my honeymoon (yes I did say my honeymoon, but that is a story for another time....) The first amp that i used to drive the DQ-10s was a Hafler DH-220, which put out 115 WPC. The speakers had 3A fuses in them and being new to the hobby I was just as happy to have them there because I would have rather replaced the fuses that damaged the speakers. And I felt my fears were justified because I was blowing fuses on a pretty regular basis (once every 2 or 3 months) About a year later a good friend of mine bought one of the "New" Moscode 300s from Harvey Rosenberg's NY Audio Labs. One night he brought it over to my place for a test drive and I was hooked.  I went in to Dave Wasserman's Stereo Exchange in NYC with full intention of buying a Moscode 300 and when i got there he had just taken a Moscode 600 in on a trade and offered it to me at a price that I just couldn't turn down. So now I had gone from a 115 WPC amp to a 300WPC amp. You would think that I now needed to be extra careful not to run the amp too hard or I would be blowing even more fuses.
Much to my surprise from the day I brought the Moscode home I never popped a single fuse. Why would this be? On the face of things it didn't seem to make sense.
Here is my opinion as to why this happened. One of the psycho-acoustic cues that tells us when something is "loud enough" is the clarity and the volume of transient peaks such as cymbal crashes (hence the concept of the loudness contour button on older receivers that boosted the frequency ranges where these peaks most often occur to make things sound "better" at low volumes.)  One of the biggest advantages of a higher power amp is not so much its ability to put out large amounts of sustained power but rather the headroom it provides to cleanly reproduce transient peaks. These clean peaks actually allowed me to push both the amp and the speakers much less and still have an listening experience that did not seem to lack volume. The Hafler 220s much more limited headroom and dynamic range cause me to run the amp much harder and use more continuous RMS watts to achieve the same perceived volume, thus the more frequent fuse blow outs. I had the Moscode for 5 years before bypassing the fuses in favor of a new protection circuit designed by George Kay that protected the output by monitoring the input signal in a way that was not directly in the signal path. But in all that time I never once blew a 3A fuses in spite of being able to achieve SPLs that would drive you from the room. (And 3 amps into a 4 ohm load is only 36 watts)
Based on this experience it has become my firm belief that it is much more important to protect a speaker from an underpowered amp that is to protect it from an overpowered one.
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Offline _Scotty_

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Re: Fuses
« Reply #9 on: February 24, 2010, 08:34:51 AM »
I suspect you were clipping the Hafler 220 into the Dahlquist DQ-10s which is what was blowing the fuses.
When the waveform is clipped you have a high power burst of DC. Your sine wave starts to look a lot like a square wave. The power factor at peak goes way up and it won't take much of this to heat up your fuse
and pop it. You were probably pulling almost three times the power out of the Moscode on peaks but you didn't clip it often enough to exceed the 3amp continuous power rating on the fuses.
Headroom is a good thing.
Scotty

Offline tmazz

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Re: Fuses
« Reply #10 on: February 24, 2010, 10:03:29 AM »
I suspect you were clipping the Hafler 220 into the Dahlquist DQ-10s which is what was blowing the fuses.
When the waveform is clipped you have a high power burst of DC. Your sine wave starts to look a lot like a square wave. The power factor at peak goes way up and it won't take much of this to heat up your fuse
and pop it. You were probably pulling almost three times the power out of the Moscode on peaks but you didn't clip it often enough to exceed the 3amp continuous power rating on the fuses.
Headroom is a good thing.
Scotty

My point exactly. That DC burst can fry drivers as well as fuses. The common thinking that the rated output of the amp is lower that the max wattage ratig of the speakers, so i don't need a fuse to protect me could be a recipe for disaster. Oftem morer damage can be done by an underpowered amp than an overpowered one. So one needs to be aware of the risks and careful when bypassing speaker fuses, no matter what size amp you are using.
« Last Edit: February 24, 2010, 10:10:23 AM by tmazz »
Remember, it's all about the music........

• Nola Boxers
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• McIntosh MC 275
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• DigiBuss/TWL PC&USB/MIT Cables