Author Topic: Grover ICs vs. Reality ICs  (Read 40383 times)

grover

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Re: Grover ICs vs. Reality ICs
« Reply #15 on: August 17, 2009, 07:55:21 AM »
Hi guys, this is not rocket science. The JPS is made from one material, this material has its characteristics. The JPS speaker cables are sloped up, not dramatically so. At the top they are magnificent as you go down they become less weighty. I'm not talking deep bass here. As I said before when Bing's voice loses its deep baritone qualities you know something’s amiss. This has nothing to do with my mechanical hearing, I hear fine. There were also 2 other dedicated long time audio friends here with me. We all agreed. It's not only the slope of the JPS but the clarity too. On the Steve Hoffman mastered recording of the Searchers it was apparent the JPS SC3 speaker cables were not separating the voices clearly. It was much more difficult to hear the separate harmonies. I have a very nice well-treated listening room and amazing speakers. This is not a mystery it was easy to hear. As I said before the RCA's outperformed the speaker cables, and focused my attention on areas I needed to improve with my RCA's. Even so the others and I felt mine to be clearer and this was the Teflon RCA's. These new non teflon RCA's blow away completely the Teflon ones in every way. One thing that interests me now is aluminum, as it appears to do highs very well.

Offline Carlman

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Re: Grover ICs vs. Reality ICs
« Reply #16 on: August 17, 2009, 08:02:24 AM »
Thanks for sharing a more detailed analysis of what you were hearing with the JPS cabling.
I wasn't questing 'whether' you had a good system/room, but what it was.. 'Really good speakers and well treated room' doesn't tell me much.

If I told you I had a really good car with really nice tires... wouldn't really help you understand the car... or what I like about it.. or really anything. 

Anyway, glad to hear you've had a breakthrough thanks to hearing JPS cables. ;)
I really enjoy listening to music.

grover

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Re: Grover ICs vs. Reality ICs
« Reply #17 on: August 17, 2009, 08:49:49 AM »
Hi Carl, all my equipment is custom made, none is off the shelf. This is so I could control all aspects of the music chain. I could get really technical to the minutest detail. I understand every detail of my electronics, and speakers. I've labored for decades on them. The fact remains what was heard by the 3 of us, was easy to hear.
at the beginning of this discussion I displayed my electronics via the Steve Hoffman mastering room photo, I can assure you that Steve Hoffman used my electronics to master recordings. This should say something as to the quality of the electronics. Would you prefer a more detailed description, discussion?

Black Sand Cable

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Re: Grover ICs vs. Reality ICs
« Reply #18 on: August 17, 2009, 09:45:32 AM »
Given he is being mentioned a few times and the fact that I was curious, I did a quick search and found a link for the gear he uses when it comes to mastering and personal use. The list was just updated so I'm assuming that it's accurate as shown.

http://www.stevehoffman.info/equipment.html


I must admit that I was a little surprised to see something from Monster Cable being used.
« Last Edit: August 17, 2009, 09:53:28 AM by Black Sand Cable »

Offline mdconnelly

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Re: Grover ICs vs. Reality ICs
« Reply #19 on: August 17, 2009, 10:05:31 AM »
...
I must admit that I was a little surprised to see something from Monster Cable being used.

Well, given the dates of his vintage components from '59-'66, I wonder what ICs were even available back then...   :-k

grover

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Re: Grover ICs vs. Reality ICs
« Reply #20 on: August 17, 2009, 10:18:15 AM »
Steve, gets to use all kinds of components. Manufactures are all anxious to have him listen to their equipment. He's a blessed man in this endeavor. He used my equipment to master for a long period of time a couple years ago. I didn't say he was using my electronics now, but did use them. You can't believe the options he has. He's truly a great mastering engineer.

Offline BobM

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Re: Grover ICs vs. Reality ICs
« Reply #21 on: August 17, 2009, 10:33:39 AM »
Grover, why don't you have a URL in your footer so I can easily find your website and look at your offerings? When people say "Grovers cables" and such I have no clue where to go to find out more about them. Can you please post a link?

Thanks,
Bob
Laugh and the world laughs with you. Cry and you'll have to blow your nose.

grover

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Re: Grover ICs vs. Reality ICs
« Reply #22 on: August 17, 2009, 10:46:55 AM »
Hi Bob here's a link to my website. http://www.groverhuffman.com/ it's not completely up to date as I've just recently discovered a better dielectric than Teflon.

Offline Carlman

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Re: Grover ICs vs. Reality ICs
« Reply #23 on: August 17, 2009, 11:31:34 AM »
Hi Carl, all my equipment is custom made, none is off the shelf. This is so I could control all aspects of the music chain. I could get really technical to the minutest detail. I understand every detail of my electronics, and speakers. I've labored for decades on them. The fact remains what was heard by the 3 of us, was easy to hear.
at the beginning of this discussion I displayed my electronics via the Steve Hoffman mastering room photo, I can assure you that Steve Hoffman used my electronics to master recordings. This should say something as to the quality of the electronics. Would you prefer a more detailed description, discussion?

Sure, I would enjoy a more detailed description... I still have no idea what you have... But I know Steve Hoffman used your gear for mastering something a couple of years ago... I don't know Steve Hoffman's ear.  I wonder if Steve Hoffman would like my gear.  Steve Hoffman sure seems like a good guy.  But I don't really know Steve Hoffman.

Bottom line: I'm more interested in Grover's system rather than what Steve Hoffman thinks of it.
I really enjoy listening to music.

shep

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Re: Grover ICs vs. Reality ICs
« Reply #24 on: August 17, 2009, 11:40:49 PM »
ditto...No offence Grover, but you're being too coy. We're all responsible adults here, with plenty of audio mileage. We're not asking for you spill your secrets in a public square! The group buys and upgrade offers from you have been super (which leads me back to MY original question regarding the SX cables). There's really no point in teasing us with whatever equipment and experience you have. We're not exactly beginners here. If I didn't know better, I would suspect your last postings as coming from a Nigerian scammer!!!!!!!!!
what gives? (oops, there he's gone and done it  :duh)

Offline hometheaterdoc

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Re: Grover ICs vs. Reality ICs
« Reply #25 on: August 18, 2009, 06:51:26 AM »
Hi guys, this is not rocket science. The JPS is made from one material, this material has its characteristics. The JPS speaker cables are sloped up, not dramatically so. At the top they are magnificent as you go down they become less weighty. I'm not talking deep bass here. As I said before when Bing's voice loses its deep baritone qualities you know something’s amiss. This has nothing to do with my mechanical hearing, I hear fine. There were also 2 other dedicated long time audio friends here with me. We all agreed. It's not only the slope of the JPS but the clarity too. On the Steve Hoffman mastered recording of the Searchers it was apparent the JPS SC3 speaker cables were not separating the voices clearly. It was much more difficult to hear the separate harmonies. I have a very nice well-treated listening room and amazing speakers. This is not a mystery it was easy to hear. As I said before the RCA's outperformed the speaker cables, and focused my attention on areas I needed to improve with my RCA's. Even so the others and I felt mine to be clearer and this was the Teflon RCA's. These new non teflon RCA's blow away completely the Teflon ones in every way. One thing that interests me now is aluminum, as it appears to do highs very well.

See,  when you make comments like this, it just further cements that we need to know more about your system... You seriously think the JPS is tipped up toward the highs and doesn't have bass weight?  And you think your cables are not tipped up and have proper bass weight?  That's just even more confusing....  If you think the JPS is tipped up, yours should make everyone grind their teeth and cringe by comparison, not the other way around... at least that has been my experience with the 6 systems I've heard your cables in... there's obviously something very different going on in your system...


Quote
Hi Shep, I'm always working to improve my cables. With my design and hand build I'm offered total freedom, unlike most cable manufacturers that have there designs made over seas, and can not change. I love my speaker cable. I found it most desirable over the much falluted JPS SC3.

No offense intended... but if you get it right the first time, you don't have to keep tinkering.  You choose your sales model, other manufacturers choose a different model.
Shane Sangster
Used to be Night & Day Audio.......

HumanMedia

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Re: Grover ICs vs. Reality ICs
« Reply #26 on: August 18, 2009, 06:53:40 AM »
Grover, does this new cabling (material/technique?) mean a revised version of your interconnects as well or is it just for the speaker cabling?

Grover??

Any answer?

grover

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Re: Grover ICs vs. Reality ICs
« Reply #27 on: August 18, 2009, 07:26:33 AM »
I thought everyone knew about the amazing ears of Steve Hoffman, he's legendary for his Mastering Work. He's taught me a ton about listening, and he's amazing to watch. In 15 seconds he can tell you where and by how much your system is non-linear, a true talent and why he's so good at what he does. I brought him into the discussion to demonstrate that the electronics I use was used by him to master. That indicates that these electronics are particularly linear top to bottom. I Love music and since high school I've built my own equipment. Over these many years I've learned a ton about design of all the components in the music chain. This ranges from power supplies, impedance, drivers, amplifiers, speakers. My favorite speakers are two ways, the simpler the better and 1/4 wave resonators with extremely simple crossovers. I use this arrangement with a wonderful ribbon tweeter. There is nothing better for imaging, and clarity than this speaker. Structurally it's superb with all the cross members combining for the long 60-inch port. Always in sound simpler is better, and the same is true in electronics. I've innovated many electronic designs, both in preamps and amps. I've found the best amplifiers in preamps to be subminiature vacuum tubes; these were the last of the vacuum tube designs and were actually designed for artillery shell proximity detonation. As such you can throw them against a wall without damage. So you can imagine the lack of microphonic problems. On top of this the electrons have much less distance to travel and as such the signal is cleaner. Extraordinary voltage regulation is completely necessary both in the preamp and amps. I'm not going to get specific with tube types (spent years and years searching for the finest sounding tubes). So I have a custom subminiature tube preamp, with rock solid voltage regulation, custom power supply with all the tricks I've learned over the years (and there's many of them), and unique feedback design. My amps as you can see in the photo are high power 130 watts of pure highly designed Vacuum tube power. I'm not a SET guy, I find the push pull design superior. It's the application that's the secret. I custom designed my driver, and I drive Russian transmitter tubes though a vintage Altec output transformer. I use my custom all vacuum tube step up and my custom phono amplifier for vinyl. Cables were the weak link in the chain and IMHO opinion are the most important. You can’t get better sound than the cable can deliver no matter how good your electronics are.  Cables are the gateway.

grover

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Re: Grover ICs vs. Reality ICs
« Reply #28 on: August 18, 2009, 07:30:53 AM »
Hi HumanMedia yes changes to both IC's and speaker cables. hometheaterdoc come on everything can improve even the JPS, if they were my cables I'd work to change them immediately, I like Bings voice Baritone.

Offline BobM

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Re: Grover ICs vs. Reality ICs
« Reply #29 on: August 18, 2009, 07:52:48 AM »
What picture? Grover, please provide a link to your stuff.
Laugh and the world laughs with you. Cry and you'll have to blow your nose.