AudioNervosa
Systemic Development => Amplification and Preamplification => Topic started by: Response Audio on November 23, 2010, 05:08:15 PM
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what do you have? I am trying to get a handle on what high quality headphones people here at AN are using. What are you using for a headphone amp? ;)
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AKG 701
no amp :(
I was using a prototype from Sol Samet but it was abandoned when we learned the actives sounded a littl harsh up high. So it's in limbo now. So I'm back in the market.
I am considering the shiit HP amp, or a diy tuber based on aikido.
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Senn HD600's with a Mini-Max head amp.
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Senn HD600s but only have an old Headroom Supreme amp at the moment so do very little listening via the Senns of late. Thinking about the Schiit Asgard headphone amp. Anyone using it?
I do use Senn PX100s at my desk plugged into the computer or my iPhone. Nice portables for the price.
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There's a slew of different head amps that work well with the HD600's. Just wander over to Head-Fi and browse the forums for a ton of recommendations, not all costly either. They also have a great classified section where good things come up for sale quite often.
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At one point I had an Senn HD595 (these were so comfy) for home with a Blueberry Audio Amp and a ATH-A900 (huge) for work. Not sure how or why... but that all dwindled down to some smaller portables (ATH-FC700a) which I'm not happy with... just not comfortable.
So I keep waiting for the elusive smaller, reasonably priced (I'm cheap) pair of headphones. I keep waiting for a great deal on a pair of ATH-ESW9s... I've also been mulling something larger like the BeyerDynamic 880s (32Ohm).
Nothing super fancy by any means.
Dave
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Sennheiser Hd 650, stax lambda normal bias, stax SR-007
Main amps have been an AMB m^3, millett max hybrid, and SRM-T1
Also have a pair of sennheiser px-100 mk II for on the go.
sent via Droid X
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I have a set of Stax SR-84 but I rarely use them because they have a speaker level input and require me to disconnect my speaker cables off the back of the power amp which is usually just more trouble than it is worth.
I use a pair of Grados (SR-60) and a pair of JBL Noise canceling headphones with my ipod
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Senn HD 600 or 650's with a Singlepower PPX 3.
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I have a set of Stax SR-84 but I rarely use them because they have a speaker level input and require me to disconnect my speaker cables off the back of the power amp which is usually just more trouble than it is worth.
I use a pair of Grados (SR-60) and a pair of JBL Noise canceling headphones with my ipod
FYI - I have give up on using the Grados and the JBLs with my ipod. Both have been supplanted by a pair of Bose IE2 earbuds. I have never before found a pair of earbuds that didn't either fall out of or hurt my ears. But the new Bose design is comfortable and stays put. The SQ is more than good enough for ipod use and they are certainly much easier to carry around than a pair of traditional headphones.
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Cool design on those IE2s. Do they seal fairly well?
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Cool design on those IE2s. Do they seal fairly well?
I really don't have much to compare them too since every other pair of earbuds I've ever tried either fell right out or started to hurt within minutes. I had pretty much given up on earbuds and one day at lunchtime I was in J&R Musicworld and there was a Bose rep there hawking this new earbud design. I told him of my problems and he urged me to just try them on. Well they were comfortable, did not fall out (then with pretty hard yanking on the cords) and the rest was history. Since they rely on those soft "hooks" the fit into the outer ear and therefor do not need to put pressure on the inner ear to stay in place, I would imagine that they don't seal as well as some others. However with the exception of a really noise environment , like a subway, I don't find the ambient noise leakage all that bad. Perhaps if I had experience with a better sealing model I would feel differently, but for me, who always had trouble with in-ear models fitting, I feel the fit and comfort more than outweigh whatever leakage there is.
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If anyone is looking for relatively small, foldable and compatable headphones to use with portable devices, but don;t want earbuds, then I highly recommend the Koss SportaPro and PortaPro. They are inexpensive and I really can't hear much of a difference between the two, so I would go for the cheaper SportaPro's.
And then there's the koss lifetime guarantee. If it breaks send it back to Koss with a check for $7 and they'll send you a new pair. I've done this 3 times already with no issues when the cord started fraying or a piece of plastic breaks. I use these daily on my commute to they take a beating.
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Thanks!
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I'm just putting the final touches on assembling a speaker-based system for more casual use. A secondary system, for more "critical" listening sessions, is past the planning stages and awaiting the necessary $$$. This system will be 'phone-based and will possess the dual advantages of allowing for later-night listening and, most importantly to me, will avoid the on-going plague of room acoustics issues I've wrestled with for quite a while. My wife and I rent the house we have lived in, contentedly, for the past 22 years. Unfortunately, remodeling a room to maximize audio playback quality is out of the question.
After having spent a good many hours studying at various websites dedicated to headphone use, I've arrived at the following configuration:
Audeze LCD-2 "orthodynamic" headphones. The current reigning champs of headphone forums, easily surpassing top offerings from Beyerdynamic, Sennheiser, Grado, etc. Orthodynamic designs, while fussier in terms of proper amp matching, are currently considered the most balanced full-range cans. The Audeze is the top ortho design. These are less pricey, at $945, than several top "standard" headphone designs, and like most ALL headphones being sold to consumers, will greatly benefit from after-market cabling upgrades.
http://www.audeze.com/
The Centrance DACmini headphone amp. This is getting uniformly positive feedback from LCD-2 users as being a suitable "match" for the orthodynamic design. Plenty of output to drive the phones to satisfying levels and includes both a well-regarded USB DAC and preamp capability for inclusion of speakers into the system. Some time this year Centrance is due to introduce a variant that will also include an onboard speaker amp. The DACmini is currently being sold for a "reasonable" $795.
http://www.centrance.com/products/dacmini/
To these two main components I'll add a Mac Mini music server, a pair of small room speakers, and whatever cabling is required. If I stop to consider how much one of the most highly regarded speaker designs might cost me, and compare to the sub $1.5k the very highly rated LCD-2s will cost with cable upgrade, it would appear that headphone-based systems are a much more cost-effective portal to the world of high-end playback quality. I won't argue the relative virtues of speakers vs headphones, NOT when it is readily possible to have the best of both worlds! - String
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Rich,
I paid a little more attention to the outside sound today as I walk around the lower Manhattan streets with my Bose IE2s on. And no they don't really seal very well at all. (But then again, remember all of my problems with wearing earbuds period. They may seal up just fine in someone else's ears).
And while they don't seal out background noise as well as I would like them to, my main goals in purchasing them were comfort and convenience, with adequate SQ for use with an ipod. Since the IE2s meet all three of these needs I am still very happy with them in spite of the less than optimal ambient noise reduction.
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If anyone is looking for relatively small, foldable and compatable headphones to use with portable devices, but don;t want earbuds, then I highly recommend the Koss SportaPro and PortaPro. They are inexpensive and I really can't hear much of a difference between the two, so I would go for the cheaper SportaPro's.
And then there's the koss lifetime guarantee. If it breaks send it back to Koss with a check for $7 and they'll send you a new pair. I've done this 3 times already with no issues when the cord started fraying or a piece of plastic breaks. I use these daily on my commute to they take a beating.
The portapro are great, I also really like the Sennheiser PX-100 mkII around that price range. The bass quality on those are really impressive.
@stringdriventhing That is probably going to be an amazing headphone rig. I'd like to listen to that sometime.
Oh yeah, try STAX too if you haven't. You'll be doing yourself a favor. Not all headphones greatly benefit from a cable upgrade IMO. Most benefit a little, but for the price, you could have seriously upgraded your other components to make a greater difference. Its a bit of an end of the road thing.
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Here is what I have. Bought them 20 years ago and they still look brand new. Just can't get around to putting them on my head,but when I do they sound amazing
http://www.amazon.com/Sony-MDR-V6-Monitor-Headphones-Voice/dp/B00001WRSJ
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I've got a pair of Senn HD600s but not a very good headphone amp so I rarely use them.
I also have a pair of Senn PX100s that I use in the office and they're great... lightweight and good sound. I actually don't want to fully block out ambient noise because it may be my phone or someone standing in my doorway.
At one point I was contemplating a Schiit headphone amp, but that Centrance looks real interesting.
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IME headphones are for those who don't have a decent listening room, and so I gave up on them years ago. I understand and highly respect those who admit to this and rather than try to spend $$$ in crappy rooms, and go the headphone route.
But I've become very accustomed to the imaging from a good 2 channel system that I don't know if I could tolerate typical headphone use. But I ran across this:
http://spl.info/hardware/monitor-controllers/2control/in-short.html
The variable crossfeed control looks most intriguing.
There's favorable 6moons review of the simplier headphone amp and this thing retails for $800 USD.
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JLM, check this out. It is legitimately amazing.
http://www.smyth-research.com/index.html
There is also the JH-3A that I heard prototyped last summer and just shipped this week:
If you didn't think our IEMs could get any better, think again. Our new 3-Way Active DSP Crossover Amplifiers will take your JH16s to a new toe-tingling audio level.
Details
•JH16 Pro, perfectly tuned with the JH-3A Amplifier
•10HZ to 23k Frequency Response (No, that's not a typo; 23k!)
•+ or - .25dB Resolution for Predetermined Audio Signature
•Phase and Time Correct
Technical Specifications
•2-Channel Analog Input or SPDIF 24/192 Digital
•6-Channel Amplified Analog Output (>100mA per channel)
•3-Way Active Crossover
•Digitally Controlled Volume Level
•Digitally Controlled Variable Bass Output - 0dB to + 12dB Boost
•32-Bit DSP Resolution
•Sample Frequency up to 192KHz
•72-Bit Accumulators
•300,000,000 MAC/S
Headphones are about to change more then just with old school crossfeed or even binaural recordings. The tech is here to allow them to emulate speakers in every way but the physical effect practically now.
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Too cool! Thanks Scott.
What does it cost? Have you heard it yet?
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I own Stax but never use them. Why you ask ? Simple no magnetic field around my head. Cell phones as well just not for me. :duh
charles
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I missed out on the 2008 Smyth demo at CanJam sadly. It was about $3,360 for a basic setup then. Here is an article about it. http://news.cnet.com/8301-13645_3-20010977-47.html
I would love to own it, though it would cost more to travel and get access to the extreme sound rooms and theaters I would like customized measurements for.
The electrostatic field in STAX headphones or any electrostatic speaker is similar to broadcast frequencies like wireless networks and cellphones. Though, the news last night was that even if it doubles your chances of cancer from the small microwave like effect it produces, only 12 more people out of 100,000 with the same exposure would get cancer from it. I'm still more worried about people who set their laptops on their lap. So if you don't want your STAX, I might be interested. :)
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I missed out on the 2008 Smyth demo at CanJam sadly. It was about $3,360 for a basic setup then. Here is an article about it. http://news.cnet.com/8301-13645_3-20010977-47.html
I would love to own it, though it would cost more to travel and get access to the extreme sound rooms and theaters I would like customized measurements for.
The electrostatic field in STAX headphones or any electrostatic speaker is similar to broadcast frequencies like wireless networks and cellphones. Though, the news last night was that even if it doubles your chances of cancer from the small microwave like effect it produces, only 12 more people out of 100,000 with the same exposure would get cancer from it. I'm still more worried about people who set their laptops on their lap. So if you don't want your STAX, I might be interested. :)
I just do not believe the factoids. There was a reason when TVs first came out warning the viewer to sit at least 4 feet away. It wasn't for your eyes as they advertised it was that the Magnetic field would lessen at 4 ft away. IMO if the true facts about magnetic fields came out the lawsuits against the utility companies would bankrupt the industry.
I am no expert in the field just a opinion I have.
charles
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TVs don't produce an electrostatic field I don't believe, it is electromagnetic as you say. Most electronics produce that, but that does not excite water molecules very much like the microwave radiation does. I would worry more about the electrostatic and broadcast device radiation myself. I always thought the 4 feet from the tv thing was so that you didn't strain and damage your eyesight, not because of the cathode rays. Like cellphone transmittion in recent years, the technology in TVs sure has changed and no longer uses cathode ray tubes. I still worry about the strain produced by staring into a strong light source and having headphones producing noise. Why can't any hobby I enjoy be healthy? :duh
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Scott,
I'm not so serious about headphone use to invest $$$ into it and I'm not sure I'd like IEM's anyway, that's what I liked about the SPL 2 Control (can be used as your overall system pre-amp).
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Headphones and especially IEMs are not for everyone I understand. I'm not into IEMs myself due to the whole custom aspect to get good sound with them. I am into the over the ear STAX earspeakers like the Smyth realiser uses. I do have decent (IMO) bookshelf or full sized speakers in every room as well though.
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I like IEMs for blocking out the ambient noise. Whether it is jet engines, or loud-mouthed baseball parents, or OPM (other peoples' music..) I also like the extreme tonal accuracy, a good reference for loudspeakers. I'd love to convert them to molded sometime. Is that a wise path Scott? Getting molds made for Shures? Can changing to molds from sponges change the tone due to longer sound pipe?
tx
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Custom molding universal IEMS is not likely to help their sound much I don't think and will be possibly more expensive while killing resell value and warranty. I would go through the process for a custom model that has been tuned for sound that way with real professionals in 3D imaging and tuning for your ears.
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Makes sense. I'll talk to you about it when/if the budget allows. Til then I'll try the smallest size foams from Shure.
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Yeah, its something that I would take a while considering too solely because of the whole "custom" aspect when combined with large pricetag.
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HD650 (set to run balanced, see note below)
Grado 325i
AKG 701
(selling a balanced portable headamp by Ray Samuels, since for over a year I have not had enough time to listen to tunes @ work - really liked the balanced feature with headphones, nothing has compared since that.)
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I see an awful lot of people lately pulling back away from the custom fit thing because they didn't feel comfortable. I'd love to try some but the price is too steep for me, I'll stick with my Sleek Sudio buds!!
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Thought I'd pass along a little gem... I was looking for a new pair of "cheap" headphones for work (student loans are kicking in - taking a bite out of any audio fun), and I ran across the following review (http://www.head-fi.org/products/panasonic-rp-htf600-s-step-monitor/reviews/5665) for the Panasonic HTF600-S Headphones.
For $30 and $15 for the Beyer Velour pads... I figured why not. I'd have to agree with the reviewer - a very nice affordable option. I don't have much time on them... they seem to be a little congested, but they have opened up quite a bit in the 10 or so hours I have on them. Decent soundstage... imaging could be better, but it's still early on. They remind me a lot of my old ATH A900s without the heft. Nice and comfy with the velour pads.
Very curious how much they will change with some more break-in. There are certainly better headphones out there... but what you get for the price, these do appear to be winners.
Dave
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I used a pair of AKG K240's for years until I got a preamp with no headphone output. I eventually gave them to a friend. K240's are still availabel for around a hundred bucks. Great for indoors, not so much for portability.
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String,
Which aftermarket cables upgrade for the Audez'e LCD-2 did you go with?
I see new Audez'e LCD-3 is priced at $1900 + ...
I may be looking at one of those for eventual headphone upgrade/addition to
{Grado 325i, Grado SR60, Sony MDR V-6}.
I have a Burson Audio HA-160 headphone amp
for normal use.
But possibly the best headphone amp in house is incorporated in ModWright LS100 preamp (running with upgraded tubes - 1957 metal base Philips Miniwatt GZ34 rectifier and two Sophia Electric 6SN7 signal tubes).
In 6 Moons review of the LS100 aws a headphone amp,
Srajan Ebaen says re
LS100 vs. [Woo Audio] Model 5 SE :
"these machines were virtual stand-ins on sound and price"
"The aural milieu was a virtual overlay, quite shockingly so..."
" In realsization mode I'd sell off the Woo as cloning the ModWright's flavor too closely."
"My accountant—the one on permanent unpaid vacation—would undoubtedly applaud and point out the sagacity of investing into the LS100 as it includes a free $4.000 headphone amp. Put this way it gives one pause to reflect on Dan Wright's chops as a very crafty and astute designer."
http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/modwright7/1.html
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I've read great things about the Audez'e LCD-2's and I'm sure you're going to love them ...especially with the combination you're putting together, enjoy.
At a much lower price point I have just sold my Grado Sr 125's and picked up a pair or brand new SR 225i's (this past Friday from my local brick & mortar audio store where I also got to see (but NOT hear the new Maggie 3.7's)). I don't really "Do" headphones much but I figure it's always good to have a pair in the house...just because...but this time I'm considering adding a Little Dot Mark IV
headphone amp/pre along with it, for [hopefully] much improved performance... Granted, I am always hesitant when purchasing "non-american" audio but in this instance it's not a lot of $$$ and the bang for the buck is simply trmendous... I'm expecting the 'totally tubular' amp to balance nicely with the Grado's extremely articulate/detailed house sound and form a good synergy...ALL for the price of a good pair of used interconnects...Go figure.
I'll keep the results updated.
FWIW here's the links
http://www.littledot.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=820&sid=18f1ec0cca2dab989123cdf1f2776d03
and
http://www.gradolabs.com/page_headphones.php?item=c56e04009f99e060f4c39dfdadb98549
Grant
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I really like HiFiMAN planars, but don't have a decent headphone amp yet. Any cans out there that sound similar but are easier to drive?
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I owned many over the years. My favorites were AKG K1000s driven by an audiovalve rkv and grado rs1/hp1s driven by a single powee mpx3.
I dont do headphones anymore though Im sure my neighbors wish i did.
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But possibly the best headphone amp in house is incorporated in ModWright LS100 preamp (running with upgraded tubes - 1957 metal base Philips Miniwatt GZ34 rectifier and two Sophia Electric 6SN7 signal tubes).
In 6 Moons review of the LS100 as a headphone amp,
Srajan Ebaen says re
LS100 vs. [Woo Audio] Model 5 SE :
"it gives one pause to reflect on Dan Wright's chops as a very crafty and astute designer."
http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/modwright7/1.html (http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/modwright7/1.html)
I think the credit should go to Alan Kimmel who also designed the Grommes PHI 26 one of the best headphone amps in existence, unfortunately very few were made.
http://www.avsuperstore.com/moreinfo.cfm/Grommes.Hi-Fi/PHI-26 (http://www.avsuperstore.com/moreinfo.cfm/Grommes.Hi-Fi/PHI-26)
Lin (in need of better headphones :( )
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Wow! Lots of different thoughts here. Many of the headphones used are those I too have considered. I want a good pair along with headphone amp for testing purposes.
After looking at countless headphone amps, I have decided to design and build my own......tube of course. I want to build one for the test bench and one for use at home.
Thanks for all the great responses.
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I hope it isn't too late to chime in. Here are the headphones I have/use.
Sony MDR V6 with the velour pads for additional comfort. I use these when I want to listen to music from a laptop or my phone.
The other headphones that I use with a Grant Fidelity DAC-09 swiss army knife are the BeyerDynamic DT48 and Sennheiser HD-580 headphones.
I got the BeyerDynamic DT-48 headphones because their design has been around for a long time and I thought they were cool. The HD580s I got because of stuff I read on the net. I like the HD580s when I want to listen to Hip-Hop or bass heavy Electronic music. It has nice bass for me without being too boomy.
Regarding headphone amplification in the future I want a tube headphone amplifier a la something from Woo Audio.
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Recently picked up a pair of AKG K550's. I'm not sure if they could be considered "serious", but they do sound really nice.
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The chassis is built for my headphone amp. I went with 3/4" solid hardwood (I decided on Poplar so I guess it would be considered softwood). It will be dyed, not stained, black. A custom transformer is being used that was original designed and built for one of our Purity products.
It will use a 100% polypropylene, choke filtered power supply.
A future Purity Audio Design product? Hmmmmm...... We'll see if there is a call for such a product from us.
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Whatever headphones you purchase, you really need to hear the Woo Audio amps to drive them. Heard them at the NY show this past weekend and they were spectacular - all models.
Of course they had amazing headphones paired with them.
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+1 on the Woo Audio. Gorgeous workmanship and some of the best sound Ive heard...
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I'm using a pair of Audeze LCD2's with the standard headphone amp on my Audiolab 8000c preamp. No dedicated cabling or headphone amp - yet. Plans are afoot in the future though ;-)
These are brilliant headphones, easily surpassing my elderly Sennheiser HD540 gold reference phones from a near 25 years ago! The only area that they're slightly weaker imho is in the treble - a touch bright/sharp, but not overly so. After doing some reading on Orthos, brightish treble is one of the drawbacks of the design it seems.
Dave
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Finally picked up a pair of Hifiman HE-6's, couldn't be more pleased.
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Picked up a pair of Senn HD650's w/Cardas cable. I gues that's not serious enough but they sound nice. :roll:
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The Senn's are an awesome headphone, but they do need a decent head amp to drive them properly.
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The Senn's are an awesome headphone, but they do need a decent head amp to drive them properly.
I'm Using the Burson 160, they sound good and I'm told that it IS good. But I dont have anything to compare it to.
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Here are the headphones I have and rotate in between. Not as serious as some others but serious for me.
I've got Sennheiser HD580, BeyerDynamic DT48 25 ohm and
AKG K701 with Balanced Fat Pipe Upgrade from Headroom.
With these headphones I use the headphone jacks on my Accuphase C200, Grant Fidelity DAC-09 or an Einar Sound headphone amplifier.
One really serious set of headphones that has caught my eye is the BeyerDynamic T5P. I just can't justify the money for this kind of headphone but it is cool nonetheless.
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Wow. This has turned into a great thread with lots of insight. My headphone amp design is taking a bit longer than expected but is coming along.
Purity orders take priority over the design of a headphone amp but we will continue on. We have also been working on a 300B amplifier design as well that we want to be in the same catagory as our Purity Reference or Statement linestages.