Living with Alan Maher CBFs

[tmazz]

Some nights its awesome and others, Eh."Tonight, Tonight won't just be any night"

Yeah, but that happened even before we put in CBFs. Just some of the reality of commercial power in a big city. Sometimes it's clean other timer all your neighbors are pushing noise back into the grid.

I remember reading on Alan's blog that a short removal would not require the whole break-in cycle again, just an hour or so to settle in. The question was posed with respect to a situation where one fell off and was put right back on. I seem to remember that he gave a time after which you would have to repeat the whole cycle, but I can't remember what it was.

But this leads me to another question. If you have a CBF on an outlet or a power cord and shut down all of the equipment connected to it there will be no current traveling through that circuit. If these things work off of some kind of magnetics, and there is no current in the wire thane there would also be not magnetic field. Isn't that the same as if you remove it from the point of view of the device? And would that mean that the break-in cycle would start over again every time you turned on the equipment. I know this would not apply to the incoming service bundle since there is (almost) always something in the house drawing power, but if you have dedicated outlets for your system it could be a concern. This would be a good question for Alan.... if we ever find him again. 

[StereoNut]

... Last night I was pumped to remove the CBFs one at a time.... The Nervosa creeped in and I just couldn't remove them...

charles

Charles

I "feel your pain".   I still have a few Alan Maher products (mostly CBF's) that I haven't tried yet because the 21 day "process" can be painstakingly s-l-o-w.    It's very hard to be patient and only install one at a time, but (as you already know) that's really the right way to approach any changes in one's system and hopefully understand what's going on. 

Anyway, I have also been wondering about the effects on the sound of my system if I started to remove some of the AMD products, to see (hear) what I'd be missing.  Except, I didn't want to be faced with the same dilemma as your stated in your last post on the subject.  The AMD "21 day roller coaster" is a tough ride to remain on for months on end without feeling worn out after a while!   That's why I was soooo interested in your results. Hopefully, once I get the rest of my pieces in place, I will eventually get up enough guts to try what you were going to do yesterday!

In the meantime, if you finally make that "leap" and start removing CBF's, please keep all of us posted!

Bill

[Phil]

I recently pulled all my PE1s (seven in all) and the Quantum AC after too many blackouts.  You can do it too!  


I doubt your results would be the same as any other system, however.  The CBFs, for example, never worked well in my system for the long-term.  And there were interactions among the filters.  

In my case, I didn't miss the PE1s but did miss the Quantum, but it just takes too long to settle back in.  PI Audio to the rescue.  

[mdconnelly]

I have to agree with the roller-coaster issues of AM products - particularly his active products.  I seem to have power outages at least once a month.  Generally the outage is just seconds, but it does have a detrimental effect.   Am I willing to toss all the AM products?  No.  The addiction is too high.   At least not until something equally as good without the downside comes along.

It is definitely all about the power and there are a ton of power products on the market.   I've been very pleased with my Uber Buss, but it alone can't quite do what AM products do given a month of continuous power.

[rollo]

   OK I pulled 3 from the mix from a total of nine.  One at a spare duplex [ connected to the line that feeds the CDP, but a different outlet], Lost a bit of fullness but some dynamics came back. Removed another at the dimmer switch again on a different circuit not affecting audio lines. Could not discern a difference. When I pulled the one attached to the tuner powercord which is on the line of the CDP MORE dynamics and less upper midrange glare. I liked that.
  The only remaining CBFs are at the circuit panel. One on each of two circuit breakers feeding the CDP and the other feeding the Pre and Amps. One in the outlet box feeding the Amps and Preamp as well.
  What we heard was more dynamics and less of a strident upper midrange and lower treble hardness. It appears the Lector is affected by too many CBFs on the line. Imaging and soundstage remained as before. PRAT however was much better. It sounded slow compared to without the CBFs. The CDP has only one CBF and that is at the panel circuit feeding the CDP.
  The toe started tapping again but that has happened many times WITH all the CBFs.  my conclusion is that I believe the CBFs change with the magnetic Field change. I cannot prove that. A theory at best but an educated one. Too many CBFs on the line for a CDP is not recommended.
  Over the weekend I will pull the CBF at the circuit breaker feeding the CDP. I tell ya what though put them on the Plasma power conditioner and cable power supply and the picture is insane.

 


charles

[StereoNut]

  Its been 6 weeks now since I revamped the CBF positioning...

charles

Just curious... what prompted you to re-arrange your CBF positioning in the first place? 

[rollo]

  It just sounded a bit fantastical [ a Carlman word] just too much of a good thing. images were larger but diffuse. Now the images are more defined in their space and depth increased. Lost a tad of volume. bass is not as strong but began bettered defined. The top less detailed however all the detail one needs.
  The main reason was the larger than life presentation. the other was a normal thing for me. Meaning when a change is made some time after say a few months of listening I remove the change to hear the difference. Sometimes we get get all caught up in the experience and THINK its better. Especially when there is more dynamic energy or it sounds more detailed. Basically a test.
  It appears the CBFs at the wire bundle are the most affective. The removal of the CBFs from the breaker itself had an affect as described but not a dramatic loss. air and decay of notes was more noticeable as I felt there was some smearing going on. Again maybe just too many CBfs.
  The saga continues.


charles

[mdconnelly]

Ya know, I've been a very happy customer of Alan's with several of his products and, overall, far better for it.  The CBFs, however, have me scratching my head.  I mean... we're talking small shiny rocks in a box, right?  It's not that I question if they are doing anything - I do hear a change in SQ (I do, I do, I swear I do... I think) -- but I sure wish someone smarter than me could explain in scientific terms what these suckers are actually doing.  Hey, I've got a yard full of rocks... what makes his better than mine

Seriously, if I could better understand what they are doing, I might just find far better ways of using them.  Inquiring minds want to know...

 

[richidoo]

Acoustic Revive power recepticles http://www.acoustic-revive.com/english/rtp/rtp_01.html claim that the minerals in their products remove static and noise. They use Green carborundum (silicon carbide), tourmaline and quartz. Japanese and Koreans have been using minerals like this in consumer and industrial products for many years.

Roll your own:
http://www.kramerindustriesonline.com/blasting-media/silicon-carbide.htm
http://www.n-ion.com/e/product/tourmaline-stones-powder/tpd-1-l.html

[rollo]

Acoustic Revive power recepticles http://www.acoustic-revive.com/english/rtp/rtp_01.html claim that the minerals in their products remove static and noise. They use Green carborundum (silicon carbide), tourmaline and quartz. Japanese and Koreans have been using minerals like this in consumer and industrial products for many years.

Roll your own:
http://www.kramerindustriesonline.com/blasting-media/silicon-carbide.htm
http://www.n-ion.com/e/product/tourmaline-stones-powder/tpd-1-l.html

 Our Professor strikes again. cool.


charles

[mdconnelly]

Thanks Rich!  An interesting avenue for further investigation...  But I'd still love to see something that reports how it works... supresses EMI?  RFI?  calms nervous disorders?  better than zoloft (I hear that takes several weeks to work as well... hmmm?)

OK, I know, I can google as well as Rich and have done so - just haven't found the obvious answers (assuming anyone has actually documented it in some manner).  I'm not being skeptical, just extremely curious.

[richidoo]

There are articles about how minerals react to stimulus, in common ways that we already know about. Piezo, thermal, peltier, it's all minerals behaving weirdly. I did not find any such articles that discuss if/how minerals interact with EMI, but I didn't look very hard. Magnets can change the shape of molecules to preserve food, cure diseases and increase fuel economy, as well as generate electric current. We also know that minerals can do all of these things and more. Magnets work by having molecules pointing in one direction so that the magnetic fields in all atoms cooperate to form a single powerful field. Mineral crystals already have all of their molecules pointed in the same direction, and atoms are all built using the same parts and the same rules. There is likely a relation to the way magnetics work. 

As with all tweaks that sound better, CBF minerals must be removing distortion at some level, perhaps damping noise in the power line by converting EMI to heat or motion or current.

[Bill O'Connell]

Descendant of Professor Irwin Corey perhaps?

[BobM]

Haven't you heard. Disney confirmed that the Pixie dust they used in all their movies was actually ground up quartz.

"It glitters so nicely and definitely helped with the quality of the picture, reducing noise artifacts and improving clarity all around. Plus it made Peter Pan sneeze. So funny!."
- Tinker Bell

[StereoNut]

... I sure wish someone smarter than me could explain in scientific terms what these suckers are actually doing.  Hey, I've got a yard full of rocks... what makes his better than mine Seriously, if I could better understand what they are doing, I might just find far better ways of using them.  Inquiring minds want to know...

Alan used to have quite a bit of info. listed on his Facebook page under a posting called "The Art of CBF Tuning."  Unfortunately, he is in the middle of re-working both his website and FB page, so I can't find a link for you guys and gals right now.  From what I remember, he said that CBF's are designed to tune out (cancel?) the noise and odd harmonics in the electrical circuits of your house.  I think the technology he uses involves treating the EMI (Maybe RFI too?) but I'm not tech-saavy enough to know or explain much else.

As far as usage goes, I have traded many e-mails, PM's etc... on the subject with Alan and for the most part the conversation always ends with the same common answer.  I'll try to explain it in my own words as best I can here.

Like everything else us audio crazies try in quest for the "audio nervana", every application (E.g.: house wiring, incoming power, the audio equipment itself, acoustics and one's own personal musical/sound preferences etc...) is (are) different, so what works in one person's system, may not work for yours.  In regards to the AMD products (even though I know this is not what everybody wants to hear) it ALWAYS comes down to experimenting with placement.  From what I understand (from strictly an audio standpoint) you should be able to hear whether any AMD product placement is "in a good spot" within the first 1/2 hour.  If you hear a rather dramatic change in your system for the worse within that first 1/2 hour or so, it will progressively give you better sound until it's maximized around that "magic" 21 day timeframe.  If you don't get this "bad before good" result, it means you should try it in another place within your home.  I only learned of this "bad before good" approach recently, so once I get up enough "courage" (read: patience) to do it, I will be removing and re-installing some AMD products too!

Maybe (?) he (Alan) will see this thread and respond on AN to help clarify things for everyone.