AudioNervosa
Systemic Development => Bipolar System Disorders => Topic started by: jimbones on November 10, 2013, 11:36:27 AM
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I am using MIT 750 music hose. I call the Cable Co. and the guy says that just about any newer cable will best my current cable. Do you think this is just "salesmanship" or do you think he is right? I am considering Tara Labs 1500 cable.
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Lots of great cables out there these days. Why not consider an independent high-end American cable manufacturer like WyWires, Triode Wire, or Snake River? You might get a LOT better bang for your buck. Disclosure: I sell WyWires.
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Lots of great cables out there these days. Why not consider an independent high-end American cable manufacturer like WyWires, Triode Wire, or Snake River? You might get a LOT better bang for your buck. Disclosure: I sell WyWires.
DAh I love the disclosure. I don't have my heart set on any wires in particular. I only mention Tara Labs because they were in my price range. I am open to other manufacturer's including Petes.
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I don't doubt that there are very good cables made today that could better your current cables (your system, your ears), but I don't buy into the statement that just about any new cable will best your current cable. That's total sales hype.
With that said, the Cable Company's lending library is an an interesting business if your prone to trying a number of different cables. It's how I first heard JPS cables many years ago.
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It depends on what you want... better is often a subjective term and depends on your personal preferences.
Ultimately, you will probably have to try different cables out. You can try to select them by reading reviews so you can get an idea of the characteristics of the cables you are considering and whether you think they will be a good fit for you.
One caveat though... there's a lot of cable companies claiming to use "single crystal" copper with ridiculous claims of ultra high purity (8N copper?). AFAIK, only Neotech, Furutech and Oyaide are licensed to produce UPOCC copper and there are unlicensed companies claiming to sell "single crystal" copper and claim to use the patented process to produce it.
And if you do choose a UPOCC copper cable there is one sonic caveat too, it's not as warm and doesn't have the "weight and body" of regular drawn copper wire. But the "weight and body" are distortion and when you get rid of it you end up with more clarity, detail, focus and better dynamics. I'm all for more accuracy personally but some people may not prefer it.
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I agree that the only way you will know for sure is to try a few different ones and see how it works in your system. Borrow from friends if you can at first, then check out the manufacturers who offer trials. Some of the local clubs have members who have an inventory of used cables lying around, and that may be a way to get something at a nice discount also.
Try a few and something will likely click in your system.
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Jim I have a bunch to try if ya like. TWL, Supra, Stealth [silver], Mapleshade active, Lenehan, Daves.
Some used some new.
charles
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I agree that the only way you will know for sure is to try a few different ones and see how it works in your system. Borrow from friends if you can at first, then check out the manufacturers who offer trials. Some of the local clubs have members who have an inventory of used cables lying around, and that may be a way to get something at a nice discount also.
Try a few and something will likely click in your system.
+1 :thumb:
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Jim I have a bunch to try if ya like. TWL, Supra, Stealth [silver], Mapleshade active, Lenehan, Daves.
Some used some new.
charles
Dave's sound interesting. I need 8 footers, preferably used. I don't want to go super expensive. what models of cables are available.
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Jim I have a bunch to try if ya like. TWL, Supra, Stealth [silver], Mapleshade active, Lenehan, Daves.
Some used some new.
charles
yeah, we'll have to talk. Maybe at the November meeting we can discuss.
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Try using the same wire used in your speakers. Find out what they are and Maybe makeshift or buy terminated.
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Has anyone ever ordered from Douglas Connection? They have Cardas posts on sale but was wondering about the Furez products (spades/bananas) :roll:
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Hi JimBones
If you have an Audiogon ID send a message to A'gon member Williewonka. He has used Furez products and speaks highly of them.
http://forum.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/fr.pl?fcabl&1382980366&openflup&1&4 (http://forum.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/fr.pl?fcabl&1382980366&openflup&1&4)
If you don't have an A'gon ID he has a blog too.
http://www.image99.net/blog/ (http://www.image99.net/blog/)
I've corresponded with him before and he was always a real nice guy to talk to. Very helpful. I tried to steer him here but I don't think he has joined yet.
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Hey Sleepyguy - decided to take you up on your offer :)
I can confirm the Furez Bananas are extremely good - better than any I've used to date.
Perhaps the only issue is the fact they are made from Copper, which is very soft. They supported my heavy D-352 cables OK, but I knocked them with my knee and they bent a little - they did straighten out OK and presented no problem since. But I wouldn't want to do this more than once
They spades will not suffer from this - they are much more robust
Regards...
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Hey Sleepyguy - decided to take you up on your offer :)
I can confirm the Furez Bananas are extremely good - better than any I've used to date.
Perhaps the only issue is the fact they are made from Copper, which is very soft. They supported my heavy D-352 cables OK, but I knocked them with my knee and they bent a little - they did straighten out OK and presented no problem since. But I wouldn't want to do this more than once
They spades will not suffer from this - they are much more robust
Regards...
Sweet. I'm glad you decided to join and can't wait to read the further discussions.
Check out AN member DaveC and his ICs or Triode Pete and the power cables he makes. Real nice stuff. Should make for some nice discussions. Thanks
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The Furuz stuff looks great for the price!
Telerium copper is fairly soft, so the tensioned tube design may not last forever but with care should provide good performance vs more common brass connectors of the same design.
A pure copper locking banana is even better but a lot more cash, spades are the best value for a good quality connector imo.
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Well - here's something to continue the Speaker Cable discussion thread...
I have just finished reviewing the KLE Innovations Essence gZero2 speaker cables from KLE Innovations.
http://www.image99.net/blog/files/fac35e44c003d559714cdd73d86febf9-51.html
Even though these cables are very skinny they outperformed my Van den Hul d-352 cables with the Furez bananas and by a considerable margin.
They do take a bit of burning in, >300 hours, but it is worth the wait.
A couple of caveats...
- the longest cable they suggest is 4 meters and the shortest made is 2 meter, with the ideal length being 3 meters - like those I reviewed - and then purchased :)
- to ensure optimum performance, that the audio systems Speaker impedance, especially the average, needs to be >3ohms and that the Speaker Sensitivity needs to be >83db
Other than that, the cables provide across the board clarity and dynamics. They provided a deeper bass response and a warmer and fuller overall tone with a significantly deeper image than the D-352
Just as general comment - I have been playing around with cables for about 4 years and without a doubt the KLE Innovations product range is extremely good. The Harmony RCA Plug range all beat Keith Louis' previous best the Eichmann Silver Bullet RCA by a considerable margin and his cables are definitely performance oriented.
Just google KLE Innovations for complete details
Their current available products seem to be geared for the more "modestly priced" systems - my estimate <$30k, but their Balanced IC's are on the drawing board and more upmarket speaker cables are on their way also.
My System definitely falls into that range ...
NAIM 5i Integrated amp
Gershman Acoustics Sonogram Speakers
Schiit Bifrost DAC - digital input streamed from an iMAC
Simaudio Moon LP5.3 phono stage
Stager Silver Solids IC with Silver Harmony RCA
KLE Innovations Essence gZero3 IC
KLE Innovations Essence gZero2 Speaker Cables
Denon DL 103 Cartridge (mod) on Audiomods arm on Custom TT
Power Cables - DIY Braided Furutech conductors with Sonar Quest IEC.Mains connectors (silver plated copper)
MSRP around $12k
But with the KLEI products it performs way above its price point
Chat Later
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Nevermind, probably better to keep my mouth shut. :rofl:
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Nevermind, probably better to keep my mouth shut. :rofl:
DaveC - speak up - enlighten us :roll:
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....... Triode Pete and the power cables he makes. Real nice stuff. Should make for some nice discussions. Thanks
and his speaker cables, and his new interconnect cables..........
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Nevermind, probably better to keep my mouth shut. :rofl:
DaveC - speak up - enlighten us :roll:
I really don't have anything to say, was just making fun of their marketing-speak... stuff like this is just... well, I will let you decide:
"In stark contrast to these approaches KL’s research has produced a proprietary Ground Zero Circuit (gZero™) which actively works to maintain a zero voltage state across the ground, protecting the signal conductor from ground induced capacitive and inductive reactance [sic]."
I'm not going to critique it specifically, but I will say that I HATE this kind of approach to marketing. Making up names for stuff, blatant lies (there is no active circuitry), etc.. it makes this entire industry look bad. Here's the entire link, it is amusing but very painful to read:
http://kleinnovations.com/kle-innovations-klei-products/essence-gzero-sc/
The product may be amazing, but the way it is promoted is old-school snake-oil.
Edit... I will say I have been guilty of some hyperbole too and everyone should be excited about their product and believe it is the best... but the KLE marketing speak is way over the top. This is an issue with a lot of audio products and a personal pet-peeve of mine, really not a big deal... I do think a lot of folks would be better off having their promotional material looked over by friends and even professionals to make sure the writing is done in a reasonable and professional manner. I think many times engineering information is taken by marketing folks and the end result is a big mess. :)
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I think many times engineering information is taken by marketing folks and the end result is a big mess. :)
+1
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DaveC - I conveyed a similar sentiment back to them regarding when I first read their web site regarding the term "Active/Passive circuitry", but, in the end, it's all in the individual's interpretation.
Their gZero technology (gotta call it something when patenting it) makes a pretty significant contribution to performance and clarity and heir products do perform extremely well!
That and - it's no worse than many other companies out there.
BTW - you have some very nice looking products yourself. :thumb:
It's nice to see someone thinking outside the box re: Cable Architecture.
I'm a fan of your style of "Braided Archtecture"(?) they perform so much better than conventional wire.
(if braided is the wrong term please enlighten me - thanks)
Anyhow - look forward to chatting some more :)
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Gzero reads a lot like these guys, but who knows, I'm not going to buy a set just to rip them apart. :lol:
http://www.tweakaudio.com/EVS-2/EVS_Ground_Enhancers.html
It's also true MANY companies are guilty of this type of marketing, I think we would be better off with less hyperbole and more factual information that will help a buyer decide if it's the right product for them. If the patent is applied for they can be more forthcoming in giving details that are not completely made-up. Personally, if I read marketing-tech like that there is NO chance I will buy even if Jesus himself is selling.
I do disagree about the definitions of active and passive being up to personal interpretation, those terms are well defined and we can't just redefine words while maintaining any sort of credibility.
Thanks for the nice words on my cables. The braided wire is Neotech's take on a litz-type design, which is intended to minimize skin effect at radio frequencies. Calculations may tell you that you are good up to ~24g wire with audio frequencies but I find better clarity and detail with their litz wire vs conventional upocc copper wire. The 14 gauge wire is my OEM product while 24, 22 and 20 are available to the public. The signal wire I use in the D4 IC is unique too, it is a improved version of the Neotech upocc silver/gold alloy wire and is also my OEM product. I make both my OEM wires available by the foot for the DIY community at the same prices Neotech would charge.
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Nevermind, probably better to keep my mouth shut. :rofl:
Your learning. :)
charles
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hahaha.
Nevermind, probably better to keep my mouth shut. :rofl:
Your learning. :)
charles
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Well I pulled the trigger on a set of Silver Cabledynes. :drool: They ship today and have a 40 trial after the ship date. I figure that gives me 37 days :lol:
The purchase was based in a demo of Bill's Silver QED's so I figured on getting a cable for a US based supplier. I like the design philosphy and the price was reasonable for what you get as they are a boutique supplier and supposedly go out of their way for their customers. I just hope I like them. I figure I should know with a few days if i am sticking with them. Wish me luck!
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Dave,
Agreed and already factored in. I assumed as much. However, I don't believe the QED cable I demoed was UPOCC or ultra pure silver. It was silver over copper and it still bested my cable. So my hope is that even if this silver is not of the purity of the "real deal" manufacturers it would out perform my cables and still save some coin. If i don't like it it goes back.
Jim, sent you a PM...
Cabledyne is one of many cable companies who sell fake Chinese upocc/single crystal wire. The prices are ridiculously low, there is no way that wire could be produced using the OCC process.
Just so everyone knows, OCC process has been licensed to 3 companies worldwide, and if the product info says "single crystal" without mentioning "OCC" or "Ohno Continuous Cast", then it is most likely a fake as the OCC claim is copyrighted internationally.
Neotech has tried to get these fly-by-night Chinese companies shut down with little to no effect.
Even worse, some companies built their reputation using Neotech wire, then switched to the fake Chinese stuff, effectively duping their customers into buying an inferior product while keeping prices high. caughTaraLabscaugh...
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hmmmm :roll: well, I can't prove them to be liars and thieves. I can suspect all I want. Purchases are made for a variety of reasons. Now I am not sure if YOU can prove them to be thieves.
Regarding the legit companies: they should have a way of identifying the cable fabricators that use their branded wire. Like letting cable manufacturers allow them to use a recognizable symbol or logo that readily identified that they are using a certified product.
Like you said if it was silver wire from one of the companies you mention the cables would have been twice the price and out of reach for me.
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Dave I am coming late to this game, but I looked at the cabledyne web site and I cannot see where they are coming off as liars and theives, nor do I see how you can call these cables fakes. I may have missed it, but at no place in the site do I see them making any claim of using neotech wire , or that their product used an OCC wire. What they do say is that their cables use a "Continuous Directional Solidification process (similar to OCC)".
Saying that their wire is made using a process that is similar to OCC is very different than saying that it uses neotech wire. I can say that a $1200 tube amp is "similar" to a $25,000 Audio Research amp because the both use pentode tubes but I don't think that many of us would think they were the same in either build or sound quality.
Claiming that something is similar to another item is simply a matter of opinion (similar too what extent?) At worst he can be accused of over estimating the sq of the products he is trying to sell (which is again still only a matter of opinion), or just using marketing technobable and weaselspeak, but if every manufacturer ()or audio reviewer) who ever did that was run out of business, I an afraid that we would all be listening to Sony Walkmen. :lol:
No if a manufacturer sent out review samples using one type of wire and then sold the allegedly same product to the general public using another, I agree, that would be dishonest. But I don
't see that from his web site.
Telling a lie has a very specific legal definition and unless Cabledyne specifically claims that they are selling you a cable made with genuine OCC wire and then sells products that do not there is no basis for calling them liars and thieves. Saying someing is similar to is just not the same as saying it is. Which is I assume why Neotech has not had any success at shutting them down. (remember back in the 60s when other copiers companies started marketing their machines as "Just as good as a Xerox. Xerox did not like it one bit, but there was nothing they could do about it either.)
Not they may be making a cheap product that does not sound anywhere as good as their claim of "similar to OCC" might lead a potential customer to believe, but that is simply marketing oversell, not dishonesty and thievery. It is up to the consumer to listen to the cables and decide if a process that is similar to OCC leads to a level of sound quality that is on par with what one gets from real OCC products. Like everything else in this hobby, it is buyer beware.
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First, I never said anything about them using Neotech wire or not. This has NOTHING to do with Neotech at all. I want to make that very clear. They are only one of three companies licensed to produce upocc products.
The issue is with them using the OCC process without licensing it, which is a patent owned by Professor Ohno and possibly the university he was working at when he applied for the patent. Cabledyne is buying or manufacturing wire using a patented process and they aren't paying for it. That is thievery, plain and simple. They are liars because their claims about the quality of their wire is not possible at the price they are charging. UPOCC silver just costs more than what they are charging to manufacture, so it is extremely likely they are selling an inferior product vs the manufacturers that are actually paying to license the technology.
Also, you left out the fact that they state "High purity solid 99.9999% Monocrystal conductors", not just "similar to OCC".
I hope that makes it clear and obvious what I am trying to say, and I am not changing my opinion on the matter.
EDIT: I'd also like to point out that by stealing the OCC technology then using that savings to undercut the manufacturers who are licensing it they are directly stealing from those who are honest by selling their products. This is a problem across many industries and I it is not open for interpretation that this is downright thievery. Even worse though, are the cable companies who built their business buying from licensed manufacturers, then switched to fake/pirated OCC wire.
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Well, I'm certainly not going to judge people on their choices, but I just want you to be aware you are supporting thieves and liars with your purchase from cabledyne.
[/quot
I guess then any product from China is supporting child labor and underpaid workers. Not to mention the abuse of woman.
I have had both Dave's speaker cable [ first run ] and TWL speaker cable .
Used both in several systems and the character of each Not bright per say but in direct comparison. The TWL is neutral with gesthalt and great tonality and very tight bass. Dave's were detailed, and lean a tad bright with deep bass.
Each speaker cable has its place. However the TWL were consistent in every system. In three systems it was easy to tell.
At the end of the day for me it is about the entire assembly of the cable not one part. yes the wire itself is a key factor but not everything. Dielectric, twisting and connector type play just as important a role.
Construction technique such as polishing, cleaning and prepping wire aides in the final product. The type of connection soldered, crimped and material of such is key as well.
In my experience as the "cable guy" in our club I will say that to date every silver based cable was lean. Every silver over copper was bright.
Cables to try are TWL, Dave's, JPS Sc-3, Mapleshade active, Tara and Cardas.
My personal favorites are TWL and JPS. Have not heard Dave's latest so not included in my comments only the first attempt.
Remember this and take it to the bank. One size does not fit all. Mostly cable "A" will sound different in different systems. If it does not it is as neutral as neutral gets. If that floats one's boat go for it. If one is looking for color change gear not cables. Try all you can and LEARN the differences heard. You CAN change your sound with cables. Or you can enjoy the sonics of your gear with the most neutral cable you can hear.
charles
charles
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Well said Tom. Basically it came down to a budget of a few hundred dollars and what can I get for that money. Being they have a good return policy, if I don't like them or think they are worth what I spent, back they go.
BTW, did some research and although Neotech uses a patented process to make the wire (which may in fact be superior), there are more ways to skin a cat and I see lots of other manufacturers claiming to manufacture high purity long/single crystal copper. Maybe it's not a lie but just not as good as the Neotech. Either way I stopped judging by advertising and let my ears tell me what I like.
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Dave if they are in fact using actual OCC wire without pay royalties on the patent they you are correct in that they are stealing it. However my point is that they never said they were using OCC, just something that is "similar" to OCC. (and sorry, I used neotec and OCC interchangeably in my last post, by bad). The way I read it they are not claiming that they us genuine OCC technology, but are rather using slick verbiage to make people think that they have something that is just as good. My point is that while it may be misleading, it is not a lie per se. Over the opp marketing maybe, but not technically untruthful. And unless they are actually using OCC materials that have been obtained through some grey market source it is not thievery either.
Could one make a case that making claims like that borders on dishonorable behavior, probably, but is simply does not in my opinion rise to the level of being a liar and a thief (which have very cut ad dry legal definitions) based on what I read in their marketing materials.
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Read here.
http://dagogo.com/an-interview-with-steven-huang-of-audio-sensibility
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[quote author=DaveC tmazz, the only way to get ultra pure wire with no grain boundaries is to use the patented upocc technology. They blatantly stole Professor Ohno's patented OCC technology. It's as simple as that.
[/quote]
If they are in fact actualy using it, I totally agree with you. But they are very careful to only say that they are doing something similar to OCC, they never claim anything as detailed as "ultra pure wire with no grain boundaries".
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Just FYI.
Unless I know for a fact, I would not make any statements which may have legal ramifications.
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If they are in fact actualy using it, I totally agree with you. But they are very careful to only say that they are doing something similar to OCC, they never claim anything as detailed as "ultra pure wire with no grain boundaries".
Yes, they do. They state "High purity solid 99.9999% Monocrystal conductors", not just "similar to OCC".
If it was just "similar to OCC" than I would agree with you, but they specify purity and no grain boundaries.
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I as a consumer (and a degreed engineer) took High purity solid 99.9999% Monocrystal conductors" and maketing gobbledygook and did not make the connectiondid not make the connection that it was equal to "ultra pure wire with no grain boundaries", but if you as a cable manufacturer are saying that it is, I will yield to your expertise.
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:)
I as a consumer (and a degreed engineer) took High purity solid 99.9999% Monocrystal conductors" and maketing gobbledygook and did not make the connectiondid not make the connection that it was equal to "ultra pure wire with no grain boundaries", but if you as a cable manufacturer are saying that it is, I will yield to your expertise.
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I as a consumer (and a degreed engineer) took High purity solid 99.9999% Monocrystal conductors" and maketing gobbledygook and did not make the connectiondid not make the connection that it was equal to "ultra pure wire with no grain boundaries", but if you as a cable manufacturer are saying that it is, I will yield to your expertise.
The purity and lack of crystal boundaries are the defining characteristics of upocc wire.
there's lots of info and a patent to look at, so it's not surprising the process has been pirated, as I said there is no respect for intellectual property in China.
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Hugh, thanks for posting the link a very informative read.
Dave, You have access to information that us mere mortal consumers do not know about. Thanks for the information and education. I hope that I have good news to report and that it sounds nice. I really hate shopping :x
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Sure thing Jim. :)
Hugh, thanks for posting the link a very informative read.
Dave, You have access to information that us mere mortal consumers do not know about. Thanks for the information and education. I hope that I have good news to report and that it sounds nice. I really hate shopping :x
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This is getting interesting. :)
From Audiogon:
Here are the facts from Cabledyne founder Ed Bowman:
Cabledyne states on their product pages: "Cryo 6-nines purity solid monocrystal square wire: Continuous Directional Solidification process (similar to OCC) offers incredible detail and clarity." The keyword is "Similar" to OCC.
Link and info from their supplier: http://hnyoukwire.en.alibaba.com/company_profile.html
"Henan Youk Electronic Materials Co., Ltd. is the largest electronic material enterprise in mainland China, based in Youk Engineering Research Center. We offer Copper Bonding Wires for Semiconductor Devices, High Purity Single Crystal Copper (4N-7N) bars / wires (0.1mm-10.0mm), High Purity Copper/Single Crystal Copper fine wires (0.015mm-0.10mm), Copper-Tin Alloy and Cu/Sn fine wires (0.020mm-0.1mm), High Purity Single Crystal Silver (4N-6N), High Purity Single Crystal Aluminum (4N-6N), Giant Magnetostrictive Materials (GMM), GMM devices, Electronic Cables and services. With a leading position in metal R&D and industrial applications, we have established business relationships with some famous companies all over the world.
Our company has an outstanding scientific team, international advanced production equipment and management experience. The technology of Youk products has reached the international advanced level. Three core technologies have been patented. Our company has passed ISO9001:2002, ISO14001:2002 and OHS18001:2002 certifications. Products also passed RoHS, MSDS, SGS, and other certifications.
Youk has the only Vacuum Melting and Inert Gas Protecting Continuous Unidirectional Solidification Equipment outputting 500,000kg/year in China. The Equipment can completely prevent the oxidation and secondary pollution of metal smelting. Precise control has ensured the stability of single crystal copper bars/wires. Due to the excellent research and advanced detection facilities, such as Element GD, TEM, EBSD and thermal analyzers, Youk can improve the performance of single crystal copper products continually."
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Thanks for the info, Hugh. I read that dagogo interview before and it sounds like Audio Sensibility is doing a good job. Hard to go wrong with OCC wire + Furutech connectors imo.
Interesting Henan was founded in '07, about 10 years after the OCC technology has been patented and documented. I will leave it up to the individual to decide what they think at this point, I have nothing more to say on the subject.
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You're welcome Dave.
Incidentally, a good friend of mine is Neotech owner's friend and so I know a little about them. :)
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You're welcome Dave.
Incidentally, a good friend of mine is Neotech owner's friend and so I know a little about them. :)
Does Mr. Pu know everyone, including all the multiple OCC manufacturers in the Far East?
I miss having phở with you, Hugh! When you coming to Brooklyn, again?
Cheers,
Pete
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Pete,
I believe so.
According to what I know, there is a very small number of factories that actually manufacture OCC wires so don't be surprised if Brand A and Brand B are both made at the same factory.
Furthermore, unless I want to get into the cable business, even I can't specify to the factory what/how I want my cables to be made for a limited run. ;)
Notice I said Factory and not through US Distributor which in turn has to comply with his/her Brand manufacturer which may or may not has their own factory. :)
In regard to Pho, we can do it again at RMAF.
We will debut our new speaker, the Seraphim. :)
Thanks Pete,
You're welcome Dave.
Incidentally, a good friend of mine is Neotech owner's friend and so I know a little about them. :)
Does Mr. Pu know everyone, including all the multiple OCC manufacturers in the Far East?
I miss having phở with you, Hugh! When you coming to Brooklyn, again?
Cheers,
Pete
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Furthermore, unless I want to get into the cable business, even I can't specify to the factory what/how I want my cables to be made for a limited run. ;)
Sure you can, as long as you need about 1000 meters I don't see an issue! :rofl:
I look forward to checking out your new speaker too! :thumb:
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Furthermore, unless I want to get into the cable business, even I can't specify to the factory what/how I want my cables to be made for a limited run. ;)
Sure you can, as long as you need about 1000 meters I don't see an issue! :rofl:
Wow, That would make a whole boatload of preamps! :shock: :lol:
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Thanks Dave.
Furthermore, unless I want to get into the cable business, even I can't specify to the factory what/how I want my cables to be made for a limited run. ;)
Sure you can, as long as you need about 1000 meters I don't see an issue! :rofl:
I look forward to checking out your new speaker too! :thumb:
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Hahaha
Furthermore, unless I want to get into the cable business, even I can't specify to the factory what/how I want my cables to be made for a limited run. ;)
Sure you can, as long as you need about 1000 meters I don't see an issue! :rofl:
Wow, That would make a whole boatload of preamps! :shock: :lol:
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Ok So here it is:
The Cabledyne speaker cables are beautifuuly made. Somewhat thinner than I expected and very user friendly.
The SQ was detailed & clean on the hi end, more pronounced bass than I expected but NOT bloated. However the sound was forward, can be a bit too much.
My current cable is MIT MusicHose 750. It was not as clean and detailed but very close. Leaner in the bass but not thin sounding either. The biggie here is that the MIT sounded more relaxed, more condusive to longer listening sessions, lower fatigue.
In the end I returned the Cabledyne, only becuase it wasn't better than my current cable. If I had nothing to compare to I probably would have ended up keeping it. I really wanted it to make an improvement so my search continues but I am doubtful of finding anything.
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Exactly, you would not know how good/bad your existing cables are until/unless you can compare them side by side with others.
As far as my own experience is concerned; there are MG Audio, Triode Wire Labs, & Skogrand speaker cables to be considered.
Ok So here it is:
The Cabledyne speaker cables are beautifuuly made. Somewhat thinner than I expected and very user friendly.
The SQ was detailed & clean on the hi end, more pronounced bass than I expected but NOT bloated. However the sound was forward, can be a bit too much.
My current cable is MIT MusicHose 750. It was not as clean and detailed but very close. Leaner in the bass but not thin sounding either. The biggie here is that the MIT sounded more relaxed, more condusive to longer listening sessions, lower fatigue.
In the end I returned the Cabledyne, only becuase it wasn't better than my current cable. If I had nothing to compare to I probably would have ended up keeping it. I really wanted it to make an improvement so my search continues but I am doubtful of finding anything.
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Signal Cable makes a range of excellent cables for reasonable prices.
When I sent them my stereo system information, they suggested their middle of the road cable, and did not push the higher priced Silver Resolution speaker cable. I am very happy with their products and reliability.
Mike
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Welcome to AN Mike!
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Exactly, you would not know how good/bad your existing cables are until/unless you can compare them side by side with others.
As far as my own experience is concerned; there are MG Audio, Triode Wire Labs, & Skogrand speaker cables to be considered.
Exactly Hugh. You could use a wire hanger (insulated) as speaker cable and it would sound fine until you do a side by side with another cable. I used Jon Risch's 89249 cross connect for years and loved it, even when putting it up against several well liked branded cables. Then I took advantage of TWL's 30 day trial offer and that bested my old stand-by's (finally).
I've since put those up against some other well ragarded cables and I am definitely keeping the TWL's.
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Good for you Bob.
Furthermore, as long as I've been in this business, there is still new thing to learn as I go along.
Previously, I thought there is only one cable out there that can better my own personal custom made cables, those were XLOs, until my recent experience at CAS in SFO. :)
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I saw a cable on Agon today selling for nearly $21,000 for an 8 ft pair. Apparently this was a "good" price because new it sold for $36,000!!!! :shock:
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I second the TWL speaker cables.
They bested some Morrow and Clear day cables I had.
Give them plenty of time to burn in.