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1
Album Reviews / Re: What are you listening to right now?
« Last post by GDHAL on Today at 05:50:33 AM »
Pharoah Sanders
Blackstone Hotel
Chicago IL
5-21-1995

Taped by PDub using Dat and Sonic Studio Mics> clone snail mailed to me back in 95>File cloned in Microtrack using a Tascam Dat deck>Goldwave Tracking>TLH8. Dolphinsmile Producer for the Dolphinsmile Archive

no setlist - 89 minutes, 6 tracks
2
Manufacturer News / Re: Getting ready for LSAF 2023 demo room
« Last post by HAL on Today at 05:00:21 AM »
Wayne and Norman are the LSAF 2023 coordinators.  Here is Wayne's coverage of LSAF 2023:

https://audioroundtable.com/forum/index.php?t=msg&th=23533&prevloaded=1&&start=0

The Audiophile Geek came in the room Day 3, but that coverage is not up on YouTube that I could find.
3
Music Discussion / Re: The RIP Thread
« Last post by P.I. on June 07, 2023, 07:27:29 PM »
George Winston of Windham Hill fame has died at the early age of 73.  I've been a fan since the 80's. 
So easy to listen to...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sf0f4-i1bdo&list=PLECA715594ACE3EC6

Indeed... 😞

Damned cancer!
4
Digital Audio Devices / Re: Modems and jitter...
« Last post by P.I. on June 07, 2023, 07:26:10 PM »

Jitter and wow and flutter are essentially the same thing, frequency modulation.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wow_and_flutter_measurement

or google "jitter vs wow and flutter" for other articles
Nope:

Wow and flutter are FM

Digital is timing which may or may not effect frequency response

'As for jitter, like noise, it is an undesired distortion of the signal. Jitter, however, happens in the digital realm and, rather than an unwanted variation in amplitude of an analog signal, it pertains to the timing of digital pulses. Of particular interest are the timing of the zero crossings and the timing of digital output transitions, which in turn depend on period signal crossings of decision thresholds that determine whether a bit is 1 or 0. In all cases, when there is jitter, the data stream as conveyed to the receiver will contain inaccurate information.

Like noise in general, jitter is often caused by electromagnetic interference or crosstalk. Both of these can be mitigated by identifying the sources and powering them down, or by creating greater spatial separation by rerouting wiring, by relocating equipment, or by placing shielding between source and affected data cable.

Jitter affects computer monitors, causing them to flicker, can degrade the operation of processors in computers and test instrumentation, distorts audio signals and garbles data in networks. Where possible it should be suppressed, except perhaps when used for special effects in music synthesis.

The principle types of jitter are:
Absolute jitter, which is a measure of the deviation in time of a clock pulse edge from its ideal location.
Period jitter, which is a variation between the ideal clock periods and actual clock periods. Synchronous circuitry as in a central processing unit is seriously impacted by these variations.
Inter-cycle jitter, which is the difference in duration between successive clock periods. When this is excessive, microprocessors cannot function.

Jitter often but not always is characterized by a Gaussian distribution. It may be non-Gaussian when caused by a power supply or other external noise. Jitter, unfortunately, has a large presence in computer networking, where it appears as packet delay variations. Due to the disruption in timing, packets are lost, a serious problem in voice-over-IP. Service may be improved by implementing effective buffering at the receiver.'

https://www.testandmeasurementtips.com/difference-between-noise-and-jitter-faq/

http://www.sereneaudio.com/blog/what-does-jitter-sound-like#listen

Those are good articles you've linked to, and I appreciate you're thorough explanation. I still believe their *essentially* (of course not entirely as wow/flutter refers to analog domain and jitter the digital domain) the same for the intent and purpose of  adding yet another variable into the "this sounds good or bad debate".

I'm more than happy with the results of the sound I'm hearing from my system.  I've read dozens of articles about how the human ear perceives sound, which "distortion" (1st, 2nd, 3rd, etc. harmonic) sounds pleasing and which doesn't, and frankly I've forgotten 90 some odd percent of it. Easy enough to google when/if the data is needed.

Thing is, I've heard so much music in my day on so many different systems under so many different conditions, that in the end I can quote Jerry (morning dew) which is to say "I guess it doesn't matter anyway". If you feel/hear/believe it does matter, then by all means do whatever you feel is necessary to remedy the issue. At some level, even the position of the earth relative to the sun and moon at any given moment also matter, as RFI and EMI (which can contribute to jitter) varies.

I let my DAC do the "de-jittering" (my term), my ears do the listening and my brain to let me know if it sounds good (to me).

Best.

Hal

 :thumb:
5
Digital Audio Devices / Re: Modems and jitter...
« Last post by GDHAL on June 07, 2023, 05:39:26 PM »

Jitter and wow and flutter are essentially the same thing, frequency modulation.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wow_and_flutter_measurement

or google "jitter vs wow and flutter" for other articles
Nope:

Wow and flutter are FM

Digital is timing which may or may not effect frequency response

'As for jitter, like noise, it is an undesired distortion of the signal. Jitter, however, happens in the digital realm and, rather than an unwanted variation in amplitude of an analog signal, it pertains to the timing of digital pulses. Of particular interest are the timing of the zero crossings and the timing of digital output transitions, which in turn depend on period signal crossings of decision thresholds that determine whether a bit is 1 or 0. In all cases, when there is jitter, the data stream as conveyed to the receiver will contain inaccurate information.

Like noise in general, jitter is often caused by electromagnetic interference or crosstalk. Both of these can be mitigated by identifying the sources and powering them down, or by creating greater spatial separation by rerouting wiring, by relocating equipment, or by placing shielding between source and affected data cable.

Jitter affects computer monitors, causing them to flicker, can degrade the operation of processors in computers and test instrumentation, distorts audio signals and garbles data in networks. Where possible it should be suppressed, except perhaps when used for special effects in music synthesis.

The principle types of jitter are:
Absolute jitter, which is a measure of the deviation in time of a clock pulse edge from its ideal location.
Period jitter, which is a variation between the ideal clock periods and actual clock periods. Synchronous circuitry as in a central processing unit is seriously impacted by these variations.
Inter-cycle jitter, which is the difference in duration between successive clock periods. When this is excessive, microprocessors cannot function.

Jitter often but not always is characterized by a Gaussian distribution. It may be non-Gaussian when caused by a power supply or other external noise. Jitter, unfortunately, has a large presence in computer networking, where it appears as packet delay variations. Due to the disruption in timing, packets are lost, a serious problem in voice-over-IP. Service may be improved by implementing effective buffering at the receiver.'

https://www.testandmeasurementtips.com/difference-between-noise-and-jitter-faq/

http://www.sereneaudio.com/blog/what-does-jitter-sound-like#listen

Those are good articles you've linked to, and I appreciate you're thorough explanation. I still believe their *essentially* (of course not entirely as wow/flutter refers to analog domain and jitter the digital domain) the same for the intent and purpose of  adding yet another variable into the "this sounds good or bad debate".

I'm more than happy with the results of the sound I'm hearing from my system.  I've read dozens of articles about how the human ear perceives sound, which "distortion" (1st, 2nd, 3rd, etc. harmonic) sounds pleasing and which doesn't, and frankly I've forgotten 90 some odd percent of it. Easy enough to google when/if the data is needed.

Thing is, I've heard so much music in my day on so many different systems under so many different conditions, that in the end I can quote Jerry (morning dew) which is to say "I guess it doesn't matter anyway". If you feel/hear/believe it does matter, then by all means do whatever you feel is necessary to remedy the issue. At some level, even the position of the earth relative to the sun and moon at any given moment also matter, as RFI and EMI (which can contribute to jitter) varies.

I let my DAC do the "de-jittering" (my term), my ears do the listening and my brain to let me know if it sounds good (to me).

Best.

Hal
6
Music Discussion / Re: The RIP Thread
« Last post by S Clark on June 07, 2023, 05:24:14 PM »
George Winston of Windham Hill fame has died at the early age of 73.  I've been a fan since the 80's. 
So easy to listen to...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sf0f4-i1bdo&list=PLECA715594ACE3EC6
7
Digital Audio Devices / Re: Modems and jitter...
« Last post by P.I. on June 07, 2023, 04:47:34 PM »

Jitter and wow and flutter are essentially the same thing, frequency modulation.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wow_and_flutter_measurement

or google "jitter vs wow and flutter" for other articles
Nope:

Wow and flutter are FM

Digital is timing which may or may not effect frequency response

'As for jitter, like noise, it is an undesired distortion of the signal. Jitter, however, happens in the digital realm and, rather than an unwanted variation in amplitude of an analog signal, it pertains to the timing of digital pulses. Of particular interest are the timing of the zero crossings and the timing of digital output transitions, which in turn depend on period signal crossings of decision thresholds that determine whether a bit is 1 or 0. In all cases, when there is jitter, the data stream as conveyed to the receiver will contain inaccurate information.

Like noise in general, jitter is often caused by electromagnetic interference or crosstalk. Both of these can be mitigated by identifying the sources and powering them down, or by creating greater spatial separation by rerouting wiring, by relocating equipment, or by placing shielding between source and affected data cable.

Jitter affects computer monitors, causing them to flicker, can degrade the operation of processors in computers and test instrumentation, distorts audio signals and garbles data in networks. Where possible it should be suppressed, except perhaps when used for special effects in music synthesis.

The principle types of jitter are:
Absolute jitter, which is a measure of the deviation in time of a clock pulse edge from its ideal location.
Period jitter, which is a variation between the ideal clock periods and actual clock periods. Synchronous circuitry as in a central processing unit is seriously impacted by these variations.
Inter-cycle jitter, which is the difference in duration between successive clock periods. When this is excessive, microprocessors cannot function.

Jitter often but not always is characterized by a Gaussian distribution. It may be non-Gaussian when caused by a power supply or other external noise. Jitter, unfortunately, has a large presence in computer networking, where it appears as packet delay variations. Due to the disruption in timing, packets are lost, a serious problem in voice-over-IP. Service may be improved by implementing effective buffering at the receiver.'

https://www.testandmeasurementtips.com/difference-between-noise-and-jitter-faq/

http://www.sereneaudio.com/blog/what-does-jitter-sound-like#listen
8
Digital Audio Devices / Re: Modems and jitter...
« Last post by GDHAL on June 07, 2023, 04:22:10 PM »
Interesting topic, Dave, and very applicable to my current situation. After many weeks of waiting and constantly pushing my internet provider, they finally were able to run  RG11 from the street to my house. It'll be 3 more weeks until they actually hook me up in the house, but hey, i'll take it. Jack has suggested a whole house mesh system and an Arris router with DOCSIS 3.1 and that's what i bought and is awaiting installation. I believe my unit is an Arris SB 6600. It uses a 12v power supply. The mesh units are TP Link.

The first thing that occurred to me is trying to use one of my 2 lps for the Arris rather than the wall wart. One lps is from Mojo Audio  in New Mexico. It is 15v and I am wondering if it can be modded/adjusted down to 12v.

Hal made a comment as to jitter. I had the good fortune to buy a used Holo Audio Red streamer which supposedly has the lowest jitter as to streamers. I will say that the performance boost over my excellent iFi Zen streamer is significant. Whether it is because of the lower jitter, I can't say, but it's interesting to note. The iFi was using the Mojo Audio lps as it's power supply.

Jitter and wow and flutter are not really equivalent.  W&F result in pitch wandering whereas jitter is more of a noise, rise time and aliasing bug.

I'm sure Ben can reconfigure his LPS for you.

Good luck getting anything don in a timely manner...  my secret cynic is pissed off right now! 😡

Jitter and wow and flutter are essentially the same thing, frequency modulation.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wow_and_flutter_measurement

or google "jitter vs wow and flutter" for other articles
9
Digital Audio Devices / Re: Modems and jitter...
« Last post by P.I. on June 07, 2023, 03:55:12 PM »
Interesting topic, Dave, and very applicable to my current situation. After many weeks of waiting and constantly pushing my internet provider, they finally were able to run  RG11 from the street to my house. It'll be 3 more weeks until they actually hook me up in the house, but hey, i'll take it. Jack has suggested a whole house mesh system and an Arris router with DOCSIS 3.1 and that's what i bought and is awaiting installation. I believe my unit is an Arris SB 6600. It uses a 12v power supply. The mesh units are TP Link.

The first thing that occurred to me is trying to use one of my 2 lps for the Arris rather than the wall wart. One lps is from Mojo Audio  in New Mexico. It is 15v and I am wondering if it can be modded/adjusted down to 12v.

Hal made a comment as to jitter. I had the good fortune to buy a used Holo Audio Red streamer which supposedly has the lowest jitter as to streamers. I will say that the performance boost over my excellent iFi Zen streamer is significant. Whether it is because of the lower jitter, I can't say, but it's interesting to note. The iFi was using the Mojo Audio lps as it's power supply.

Jitter and wow and flutter are not really equivalent.  W&F result in pitch wandering whereas jitter is more of a noise, rise time and aliasing bug.

I'm sure Ben can reconfigure his LPS for you.

Good luck getting anything don in a timely manner...  my secret cynic is pissed off right now! 😡 
10
Album Reviews / Re: What are you listening to right now?
« Last post by GDHAL on June 07, 2023, 01:44:45 PM »
B.B. King
2. Aalener Jazzfest
Aalen, Germany
1993-11-05
 
FM broadcast

Label: none
Lineage: SDR3 FM master or 1st gen. copy from at least two different broadcasts (made with an unknown tapedeck, the tape is a SONY UX-S, because they were cheap) played on Harman Kardon TD 212 > audacity > you
Sound quality: Some FM statics audible - way better than my last BB King post here. But I doubt that the songs are in the correct order! Maybe the speed is correct this time (sounds good to my ears anyway). ;-)

This is another find from my vault:
An absolutely great performance from this legendary festival in the South of Germany.
If you like the blues - and I guess you are because you're reading this text: this IS THE KING of the Blues accompanied by a helluva band and the great CHAKA KHAN on the last three tracks! Play it loud!

01. BB King introduction
02. Let The Good Times Roll
03. Chains Of Love
04. Ain't Nobody Home
05. Sweet Little Angel - Nobody Loves Me But My Mother
06. All Over Again
07. Caldonia
08. Night Life
09. Rock Me Baby
10. Please Accept My Love
11. The Thrill Is Gone
12. Chaka Khan introduction
13. Playing With My Friends *
14. We're Gonna Make It *
15. Something You Got *

TRT 85:46

Band

B.B. King - Guitar, Vocals
Michael Doster - Bass
Leon Warren - Guitar
James Toney - Keyboards
Calep Emphrey Jr - Drums
James "Boogaloo" Bolden - Trumpet
Walter King - Saxophone
Melvin Jackson - Saxophone
Tony Coleman - Percussion
Chaka Khan - Vocals on *

=======================================================================================
Many thanks to the original uploader for sharing this B.B. King broadcast.
The orginal files were running slow. This file set has been pitch-speed corrected with Magix. SBEs fixed with TLH.
"Nobody Loves Me But My Mother" was added to the end of "Sweet Little Angel" to keep that medley as one track.
File set was normalized to -0.26 db. No other adjustments. Sidewindersf November 2022
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