Do you ever just have to bite your tongue?

[Carlman]

nuforce - nothing I can say is good, at least those I've heard so far and to my ears.
.......

But have you heard them with their $1k a pop Black Ice conditioners?
Its quite interesting how Jason has changed his tune regarding powerconitioners, now that he is marketing them..... I'm still waiting for that email acknowledging that I was right and he was wrong.
The last communincation I got from him was titled 'Why you so rude?'

Actually, the mids and treble becomes reasonably acceptable with an Adept or diy efforts (and I assume, their own conditioners).

I'm still wondering how they managed to get all those rave reviews.

-Paul

Good luck on that apology...   I wondered the same thing about the reviews... Maybe they're bass heads.

[lonewolfny42]

Carl....

I wish people didn't rave about gear until they spent more time with it... Then there wouldn't  be as many 'darlings'.

Thats where you ask them "What other equipment have you owned or listened too ?".....

Have a Happy Easter Carl....

                                    ....................Chris

[djbnh]

NAD..NAD...NAD....NAD.....NAD's! 

I see what you mean! I think I like saying it now to!

I must admit that I have owned a few NAD pieces and for the most part they worked but didn't leave me longing for more. I do like how they keep it simple especially with their receivers. No goofy surround settings or anything like that just a simple easy to use box. The problem I had was more often than not, my NAD box would die on me and end up needing to be taken in for repair. I have heard that they are better now but for a time I don't think the word reliability and NAD went together. I had the T-773 for a time that was in the shop 3 times in less than a year as to give but one example. I also cant stand NAD for not allowing owners to do their own firmware upgrades. This policy that NAD and others have has always been a sore spot with me.

Just an aside on NAD - I purchased the 2200PE amp and an NAD preamp w/MM-MC section waaay back in my military days in Germany, in the latter 1980s. I'm still using the equipment, albeit with my TV gear, and had nary a problem outside of having one of the plastic speaker connectors crack some 6 years ago (subsequently replaced by a DIY friend, along with the stock PC). For what I paid at the PX and the pleasure the gear gave me and my family at the time, the NAD purchases were steals. [I note that the preamp still functions as a wicked good headphone amp.] Just my $0.02 re: reliability, price/performance, I've got some nice memories about NAD and my first foray into mid-fi. Would be an interesting experiment to hear the aged 2200PE if its innards were tweaked / upgraded w/ higher-end parts.

[thechairguy]

Hey, can I piss on some toes, too, in this topic? 

At last count I have bought 6 PS Audio items in my lifetime.....the best have proven to have added nothong significant (the Noise Harvestor) and the rest have caused sonic degradation (their power cord of a few years ago and Ultimate Outlet particularly come to mind).

And yet, I find myself every-so-often interested in their new'ish phono stage, the GCPH    Paul McGowan's marketing hyperbole is that good.

I think I'm glutton for punishment 

It's been a while since visiting - hi y'all

John

[Carlman]

Hey, John...  Thanks for stopping by!
I have to say I agree... PisS Audio's stuff is some of best-marketed, nice-looking equipment (that sucks) I've used.  It's really nice to look at.  I have an 'Ultimate Outlet' I bought used... and after hearing it, I don't know what to do with it.... I guess I could use it for my printer or PC's... but I'd just assume use the Cooper I bought at Lowe's for $2.  It seems well-contructed and nicely-finished, though... But I wonder if there is any real science to what they do..
-C

[richidoo]

I asked for their Coal to Coltrane DVD. It was lousy. A little about Tesla, a LOT about Edison, as usual, and nothing, NOTHING at all about their product line, which is the reason I spent 20 minutes watching it. Stupid waste of money to make that DVD.

Heard their then new little digital amps at RMAF 06. Nothing special. I have heard that the Power Plant build quality is not great considering the price. But Yup the marketing is good.

[bobrex]

Well, I'll counter the PSA complaints - I use a Power Director; for the price it does just what I expect it to do and does so with no negative impact in my system.  I use it tied to a dedicated 15 amp circuit, it removed some grunge and gives me peace of mind with power surges. 

As far as the Coal to Coltrane video, I don't recall that it was done as a product catalog, I thought it was intended to be a primer on domestic electricity.

I've decided to bite my tongue on the SL1200 fervor. 

[Carlman]

BTW, I haven't used the director... I don't doubt that some of PSA's products are helpful... and looking back I shouldn't have said they 'suck'... just 'don't do it for me'... would've sufficed.

[canyoneagle]

I've had to use some serious restraint (but not always) whenever someone (either new to audio or who considers themselves 'into' the hobby) raves about Bose. 

I'll typically try to tactfully point out that while Bose sounds okay, one can enjoy significantly better sound for not much more (and sometimes less) money.

[Carlman]

I've had to use some serious restraint (but not always) whenever someone (either new to audio or who considers themselves 'into' the hobby) raves about Bose. 

I think *most* people (i.e. not people at AN) are told what sounds good rather than assessing it themselves.  So, if you were told all your life that Bose is the best, and you haven't really thought enough about it to research audio systems, or their reproduction qualities, then it IS the best. 

It's a different world than what I live in today but I see it and understand it because I recognize most people can't see beyond the nose on their face.  I hear people boast that Cadillac makes the 'best' car... because to a lot of people, the ability to purchase an object of such an expense is rare and seems unobtainable.  You must be RICH to drive a Caddy... or buy a Bose... It's a status-object... not a passion or hobby.

Luckily there are enough folks in the world that simply analyze things for their joy and the price/status/income has little to do with the outcome.  I find that there is a parallel to a joy-seeking way of life as there is to being on a journey to finding the best musical experience.  I meet that level of person in this hobby which I genuinely treasure. 

[bpape]

Well said.  The journey is half the fun. 

Bryan

[richidoo]

When a neighbor starts talking about buying Bose for $1000 I give him some back issues of HT mags and invite them to hear my tiny deftech pro 60s. Then they can go to the BOSE store and see what they are really offering. I admire the great marketing that PS, BOSE and many others do, more power to them. Their employees kids get fed and they have fun in the audio biz. What could be better? But the forums give the dirt on what the value is really like, compared to other brands and a little jive makes no difference on their bottom line.

bobrex, I for one would love to hear your POV on SL1200....   I think we are currently Technics free zone now that chairguy has sold his. I have a Q2 only until I can get a Project or Rega, (or build one???) but I freely admit the SL-Q2 is nothing more than a vintage midfi spinner that I got for free.

[canyoneagle]

Luckily there are enough folks in the world that simply analyze things for their joy and the price/status/income has little to do with the outcome.  I find that there is a parallel to a joy-seeking way of life as there is to being on a journey to finding the best musical experience.  I meet that level of person in this hobby which I genuinely treasure. 

Yes, VERY well said, IMO.
I feel the experiential is far more meaningful than the theoretical/intellectual.

What is the experience of a waterfall, in contrast to the concept of one?

 

Warmly,
Michael

[richidoo]

I split off the Technics SL1200 discussion to a new thread so it can have a life without feeling hijacked.

Click here to go to "Technics TT"
Thanks
Rich

[Inscrutable]

Not sure who said it first, but 'where do I start' seems to be the prevailing sentiment, and same here.

Agree with so many of you:
Have yet to find any digital amp that did anything for me
Agree about the Kharma's, and add Wilsons and the huge Dynaudio's to the list for similar reasons.
At the other end of the $ spectrum, the Omega's I had left me scratching my head over their cult following

On a positive note, I've yet to hear any ProAc speaker that DIDN'T do it for me. I think more about music than speakers when I am listening to them.

I do think there is a lot to the negative synergy thought. I've just heard too many things that people I know (and whose biases I understood) liked, and yet left me scratching my head.  And of course a leading cause of that is the room, in the case of shows.  Yet isn't it funny how some guys' rooms always sound good?