Author Topic: TacT is OUT, Lamm is IN  (Read 9161 times)

miklorsmith

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TacT is OUT, Lamm is IN
« on: March 28, 2007, 09:17:50 AM »
Against the angel on my left shoulder, the devil on my right has won.  The TacT is up for sale and I've bought a used Lamm LL2 Deluxe.  This will facilitate my ongoing investigations into Inguz-based room correction and will get a tube preamp back into my system which I think I have missed.

Think?  I've had the TacT and solid state pre outputs for so long that I don't remember for sure.  As I've been migrating my system I've kept the Signature amps playing for the most transparent window into the gear changes.  The Yamamoto has been sitting in a box, patiently waiting its turn.

I've been feeling that the sound overall is chilly.  Everything is there, detail's great, bass is solid, nothing annoying.  But, uninvolved.  Ever since getting the Druids about 3 years ago I've thought the Zu 10" widebander inherently warm.  I've found only recently that isn't true.  Feed the Definitions a fully solid state signal and they take on that personality.  I've marveled that my system has become all SS and even thought "who needs tubes".  But then I keep wondering what's missing.

Last weekend I threw the Yammie back in the mix just for kicks.  WOW - All the colors came back and the love was right there.  I had been planning on a tubed pre for a while and had my eye on the Lamm but was playing it cool (with the ladies).  All that went out the window and I pulled the trigger.

I should have the new pre next week and hopefully the TacT will sell soon so my promise to my wife that this swap won't cost us anything will actually come true!

lonewolfny42

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TacT is OUT, Lamm is IN
« Reply #1 on: March 28, 2007, 12:22:17 PM »
Brooklyn in da house.... :lol:  (Lamm is made in Brooklyn, NY)

Good luck Mike.....a few reviews....here.......and ....here...... :wink:

WEEZ

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TacT is OUT, Lamm is IN
« Reply #2 on: March 28, 2007, 12:37:27 PM »
Nice choice!

WEEZ

miklorsmith

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TacT is OUT, Lamm is IN
« Reply #3 on: March 28, 2007, 12:53:11 PM »
Thanks!  I read those reviews and a few more.  Besides the usual "love it" accolades, two comments really caught my attention:

One reviewer pointed to an ever-so-slight emphasis in the midbass.  I've got the low bass covered with the separate array but if there's any complaint I have with the Definitions it's that they can get a little hot in the presence band and consequently seem a little light in the midbass.  The TacT could handle this issue beautifully.  If I dial everything in without EQ on the mains, sweet!  I'll still be pursuing Inguz no matter what.

The other piece was in the Stereophile review, specifically the "Measurements" section.  Frankly, I've never derived anything useful from these but I usually read them anyhow.  In describing distortion behavior of the LL2 he says it elevates as the input impedance drops.  The measured distortion characteristic is almost entirely 2nd order which us a-holes (I mean a-heads) associate with yummy tube sound.

At 20 kOhms, JA says the distortion is getting audible, but still within acceptible limits (and we all know  what JA considers acceptible)  At 100 kOhms the distortion is extremely low.  My very clean-sounding Signature 70 amps have 20 kOhm impedance and will benefit from a higher tube sound and my Yamamoto has a 200 kOhm impedance and should receive very little "extra" from the pre.

To me this is the Perfect Situation on paper.  If the prediction bears out the theory, I'll be one happy camper.

Offline Woodsyi

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TacT is OUT, Lamm is IN
« Reply #4 on: March 29, 2007, 10:04:27 AM »
Bad timing, Mike.  It's getting warmer outside.  You do tubes in the winter and SS during summer.  :wink:  At least that's how I justify my use to my energy conscious wife -- as a heater.  8)
I am a nut.

miklorsmith

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TacT is OUT, Lamm is IN
« Reply #5 on: March 29, 2007, 11:04:15 AM »
Funny you should bring up the wife.  Even though I assured her this was a CASH NEUTRAL swap, she got pissed.  In her defense I unwisely told her a while back that I was done with my rig.  Bad Miklor!

shep

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TacT is OUT, Lamm is IN
« Reply #6 on: March 29, 2007, 12:54:18 PM »
Ahh! the joy of being single...no one to account to but my conscience and my bank ballance :D

Offline Woodsyi

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TacT is OUT, Lamm is IN
« Reply #7 on: March 29, 2007, 01:18:46 PM »
Shep,

There are some benefits to being married (to a hot woman).  8)

Mike,

I look forward to your review especially if you can compare it to the SWL 9.0 you had in your system.
I am a nut.

miklorsmith

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TacT is OUT, Lamm is IN
« Reply #8 on: March 29, 2007, 01:33:12 PM »
Ooo.  That will be tough.  I had the 9.0SE in the system probably 18 months ago now, with the Def. 1.5s.  I've swapped sources and amps since then (maybe I'M the nut!).  I do have a reasonable sonic picture in my head of the Moddie and I'll try my best.

My wife is actually great.  She gives me more latitude than I deserve most times.  This one was a little funny because I couldn't figure out what in the world was up!  Did I cheat and forget, did I sell the cat or the house, did I forget an anniversary/birthday, did I "redecorate", did I shave the kids' heads/cat, did I quit my job, did I zig when I should have zagged, did I upset the apple cart, WHAT?

shep

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TacT is OUT, Lamm is IN
« Reply #9 on: March 29, 2007, 01:38:04 PM »
I guess they run hot AND cold! At the end of the day, I think they just tolerate us until something better comes along! With that I better shut up.

miklorsmith

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TacT is OUT, Lamm is IN
« Reply #10 on: April 09, 2007, 01:12:37 PM »
Early return:

I haven't gotten the Yammie to fully gel with the Lamm yet, but with the Signatures it's golden.  I feel confident saying after only a week this is one of the best audio purchases I have ever made.  Maybe it's a lightning strike that it fits into my system perfectly but if it can bring the same game to other setups (which I will try), it's a Piece for the Ages.

jrebman

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TacT is OUT, Lamm is IN
« Reply #11 on: April 11, 2007, 05:03:52 AM »
Mike,

Congrats.  I've heard the Lamm pre several times and it is wonderful.

Glad to see that somebody else is hearing the same kind of things in their 70s -- just about perfect, but still something missing (to my ears, that is).  I just got a new tube pre -- a modded Eastern Minimax which I'm hoping, with a few nice NOS tubes will complete the picture for me.  Of course I'm still waiting for a pair of ICs that I ordered and that I need to be able to put the pre in the system, but hopefully those will be here in today's mail.

I'm following all this closely as there seem to be a number of Sig 70 owners who are feeling the need for a tube front end, and if I get it right with this, then I know I will be as close to nirvana as my budget will allow.

Guess the pissed wife thing means no deal on the EM7 amp?

-- Jim

miklorsmith

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TacT is OUT, Lamm is IN
« Reply #12 on: April 11, 2007, 07:42:49 AM »
Oh!  Sorry I forgot to return the PM.  That's a fine deal (is it the newest 3.5 watt version?).  I don't have any cash right now but I always have a list of desires when funds come up, which they sometimes do.

The Signatures with or without a tubed preamp, an interesting question.  I had been running the Sigs through the TacT and Lessloss DAC (essentially a neutral SS preamp).  "The panel" liked this sound but preferred the Yamamoto significantly as having better harmonic bloom (I can't disagree).

Then I started experimenting with gear swaps and reasoned since the Signatures are more neutral, they should also be more transparent to let me know what's happening with the changes.  I was using a different SS preamp.  I thought "how about that, I'm running an all SS rig", which I never thought would happen.  I found myself detached from the music, everything was there without annoying bits, great transparency, I couldn't find a fault but yet didn't feel moved by the performance.

Just for kicks I put the Yamamoto back in the rig and the colors rushed back in!  One thing quickly led to another and Hello Lamm.

In an essentially neutral system, the Signatures aren't tube amps.  They won't imbue instrumental weight in nearly the same way.  However, in a system of warmer thoughts they might just be the smooth customer to finalize the deal.  I'm not surprised there's folks on both sides.  When I get the Altmann back, I'll try going straight from the Altmann to the Signatures and see where that goes.  I doubt it will be holographic in the same way the Lamm is but I bet it would be a "long haul" candidate.

Lamm thought of the day - I was listening with my mom the other night.  She's not an audiophile by any stretch but she has a nice setup and loves music.  We listened to Kind of Blue straight through.  Both of us have heard this album 1000 times and I've used it to evaluate horn tone for the last 7 years.  No kidding, we both thought it sounded like a different recording, and she's heard it at my house on this basic setup at least 5 times before.

I frankly didn't know the horn dynamics were recorded so well.  And, the overall performance context was greater than I've heard it.  The piano has never made much sense to me on this album, just tinkling keys "over there".  Mom noticed the interplay between the piano and trumpet which she hadn't before.  And the bass strings seemed stronger and wholly involved with the performance, which they never have for me before.  Even though the horns are obviously placed heavily in front of the mix, the rest was brought forward to give real significance to the entirety.

It was one of those home run moments we all hope for in our madness.

jrebman

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TacT is OUT, Lamm is IN
« Reply #13 on: April 11, 2007, 08:23:01 AM »
Quote from: "miklorsmith"
Oh!  Sorry I forgot to return the PM.  That's a fine deal (is it the newest 3.5 watt version?).  I don't have any cash right now but I always have a list of desires when funds come up, which they sometimes do.

Is that a typo, or is there really a 3.5 watt version?  I was talking with Roger just last week and we talked about my amp and he never mentioned a new version.  Hmmm, going to have to look into that -- maybe it is something that can be retrofitted.  Still don't think it will work for me in the long run, but it would at least be good to know for a prospective buyer.

I thought "how about that, I'm running an all SS rig", which I never thought would happen.  I found myself detached from the music, everything was there without annoying bits, great transparency, I couldn't find a fault but yet didn't feel moved by the performance.

Bingo!  That's where I am with all this, and btw, I am running an all SS system, which I thought wwould never happen to me as well.

Just for kicks I put the Yamamoto back in the rig and the colors rushed back in!  One thing quickly led to another and Hello Lamm.

Well, the minimax isn't a Lamm, but the modded version is supposed to be fantastic for the money and quiet too, and the recommendation came from another guy who is using a Sig 30 and who is also basically atube guy and whose findings sound very much like what you and I are hearing/describing.  He liked the minimax better than his $7k Levinson.  So, I'm hoping this will bring that missing element back.

It was one of those home run moments we all hope for in our madness.

Yup, and I'm sitting here just waiting for the pitch -- I'm one pair of ICs away from the audition beginning.

-- Jim

miklorsmith

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TacT is OUT, Lamm is IN
« Reply #14 on: April 11, 2007, 08:44:16 AM »
The Minimax is a great choice.  There's a reason they have won awards.  I've heard that tube rolling is fun with them, as in different flavors of goodness.  The stockers are supposed to be fine.

My guess is this will be a revelation.