AudioNervosa
Systemic Development => Amplification and Preamplification => Topic started by: Emil on November 25, 2016, 09:58:57 AM
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So one of my 300Bs is beginning to hum and needs replacing but before I do, looking for opinions on First Watt and its many versions.
Now keep in mind that I'm using EHs now and have no plans to spend more than say $150 a tube.
has anyone spent time with First Watt amps? Will I miss the 300Bs considering I'm using bargain basement tubes.?
Bored at work............
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you should contact ,JBtrio he has killer 300bs and a Pass Labs amp he just loves. he could shed some light on the subject.
300bs get expensive fast,,the SS offers reliability and the low power pass labs might be that special enough to woo most people away from tubes.
Talk to someone who actually has experience with lots of tubes and gear, not just quotes from the internet, or full of BS,, call Joe.
He tries lots of tubes, not just stuck with the same pair for years
No one here knows more about these tubes than Joe, and he had direct experience with several Pass Labs amps used in his low power high eff system.
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Thanks Topround
Yes, Joe has the Coincident 300B amp and Pass Labs 30.8 and he prefers the 300B . The problem for me is he uses higher end 300B like the Elrog.
If he had the EHs he may have leaned towards the Pass.
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Shuguang Black Treasure 300Bs were worth every penny to me. I think $300 each when I bought them? Don't know what they cost now. I used them in my Manley SEPP monos. I forget the other 300Bs I had to compare, but they weren't really expensive. One was original Manley tubes, maybe Sovtek or something cheap like that, sounded genuinely bad. The other was supposed to be upgrade, Sophia I think. Both really sucked compared to Treasure which sounded gorgeous. Made by communist state owned factory in China. $280ea
Gold Lion has 300B tubes now. All their other tubes are very well regarded, and made by American owned company in Russia. I have their KT88s and love them. $140ea
This review compares EH to Gold Lion and Treasure, et al.
http://blog.thetubestore.com/300b-tubes-review/
Beware internet tube comparisons, especially posted by tube seller!!
My First Watt B1 kit sounded pretty bad until I modded it with different transistors. The bad sounding MOSFETs were the whole purpose of the B1. I've noticed people don't seem to keep First Watt amps very long. Imo, they were originally designed to be simple to build for DIY, designed around an interesting part or topology to prove a technical point, not necessarily for ultimate sound quality. For that you gotta pay up for the Pass name.
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Hey Emil,
The First Watt amps are really nice. Probably a M2 would be a better choice with your speakers over the J2. Give Mark a call at Reno Hi-Fi he is a wealth of knowledge pertaining the Pass Labs and First Watt.
Actually running the 30.8 for 6 weeks while my 300b was getting fixed really improved sound wise. Maybe it needed more time to break in but, now I think they each have some positives and negatives. The only thing the Franks have over the Pass is in the midrange and texture.
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Sorry Rich, I have to disagree with you. The First Watt amps are excellent sounding. You need to match the right speaker to their specific amp model, IMHO
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So what washroom will you use if you choose a "First Watt" ?
:rofl:
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So what washroom will you use if you choose a "First Watt" ?
:rofl:
Hopefully sanity will returned and I'll be using a washroom with other "dicks" :lol:
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Thanks Joe
I was thinking about the M2 myself. I'll grab one if I see one for a good price.
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Sorry Rich, I have to disagree with you. The First Watt amps are excellent sounding. You need to match the right speaker to their specific amp model, IMHO
Yeah, that's true. :thumb:
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Emil tubes are less expensive then a new amp. Maybe you could borrow and demo some 300B tubes from Pete or Joe. A Tube Rave maybe. Or amp rave.
charles
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Hi Emil,
I've bought tubes from this place before and they are having a sale today.
http://www.thetubestore.com/Tubes/300B-Tube-Types
Go for the Genalex - Gold Lion PX-300B
Best of luck.
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Just picked up a First Watt M2 at a good price so we'll see.
Of course the seller is from the west coast so I'll have to wait a good 5 days for it to get here :lol:
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Hey Emil,
Good for you. Let us know how it works out. Hopefully, it will have good synergy with your set-up!
Joe
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Yeah! I hope it works out great. Have fun!
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So I scratched that it.
The M2 is a fine amp but not as musical as my 300B on my horns. I kinda knew that but needed to find that out for myself so back on the market it goes.
Jbitro nailed it. The Pass lacks midrange and texture of the 300B.
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Hi Emil,
I've bought tubes from this place before and they are having a sale today.
http://www.thetubestore.com/Tubes/300B-Tube-Types
Go for the Genalex - Gold Lion PX-300B
Best of luck.
This seems to be the direction I will most likely go.
Upscale Audio has them for the same priced but cryoed and tested in an actual amp prior to shipping.
Any thoughts on cryoed and dealing with Upscale Audio?
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I'm also thinking about bring this amp up the 21st century standards by replacing the captive cord with an IEC connector are hardwiring it with one of Pete's cords. Replacing the RCA input and speaker connector strip with Cardas binding posts would also be a nice touch :thumb:
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=93370)
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The rectifiers are GE5AR4 rectifiers and for all I know they may have never been replaced. How long do they usually last? Any recommendations on a replacement?
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I'm also thinking about bring this amp up the 21st century standards by replacing the captive cord with an IEC connector are hardwiring it with one of Pete's cords. Replacing the RCA input and speaker connector strip with Cardas binding posts would also be a nice touch :thumb:
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=93370)
Emil - I could help you out with the binding posts since I'm a Cardas & Furutech OEM... let me know...
Pete
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The rectifiers are GE5AR4 rectifiers and for all I know they may have never been replaced. How long do they usually last? Any recommendations on a replacement?
GZ34 (5AR4) rectifiers last a long, long time... To my ears the Mullard GZ34 are the best and they made millions for the masses and other companies.
Try to find a "off-brand", such as Sonotone. The printing on the tube will indicate "Made in Gr. Britain" and Mullard was the OEM!
Cheers,
Pete
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I've had great experience with Jim McShane for my tube dealings. He does really thorough real world tests. I like dealing with Jim McShane vs. Upscale Audio. With Upscale my experience there is a bit of ego in dealing with them. Be ready for that. With Jim I didn't have that.
Hi Emil,
I've bought tubes from this place before and they are having a sale today.
http://www.thetubestore.com/Tubes/300B-Tube-Types
Go for the Genalex - Gold Lion PX-300B
Best of luck.
This seems to be the direction I will most likely go.
Upscale Audio has them for the same priced but cryoed and tested in an actual amp prior to shipping.
Any thoughts on cryoed and dealing with Upscale Audio?
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I've had great experience with Jim McShane for my tube dealings. He does really thorough real world tests. I like dealing with Jim McShane vs. Upscale Audio. With Upscale my experience there is a bit of ego in dealing with them. Be ready for that. With Jim I didn't have that.
That's not the first time I heard that.
Jim McShane it is then
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Just sold the First Watt M2 for Watt ( pun intended) I paid :thumb:
That was painless
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Both Upscale and Jim M. are excellent sources of tubes: with them you know the tubes will be tested and burned in properly. And both will stand behind their products. Jim is often a bit less expensive.
IME, cry'od tubes are more relaxed sounding than ones that aren't. Whether you want that or not is up to you. The Gold Lion KT88s would benefit from that but I don't know about the 300Bs.
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The rectifiers are GE5AR4 rectifiers and for all I know they may have never been replaced. How long do they usually last? Any recommendations on a replacement?
IIRC, some GE 5AR4s were made by Mullard. Check the tube, as Pete suggested. If it wasn't a NOS Mullard will be a nice improvement.
Your other thoughts about upgrading the amp will do the same, esp. if you use Cardas un-plated Cu binding posts. And Pete's power cables, of course. :thumb:
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Congrats, Mr. Two-calendar! :lol:
SN
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Another vote for Jim McShane. I have also had good dealings with Cryoset,when I got the kt77 tubes for my Response Audio 3205. The genelax Kt77 needed for high and not knowing that I got low buas tubes , which were replaced without any push back.
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The rectifiers are GE5AR4 rectifiers and for all I know they may have never been replaced. How long do they usually last? Any recommendations on a replacement?
GZ34 (5AR4) rectifiers last a long, long time... To my ears the Mullard GZ34 are the best and they made millions for the masses and other companies
Try to find a "off-brand", such as Sonotone. The printing on the tube will indicate "Made in Gr. Britain" and Mullard was the OEM!
Cheers,
Pete
Look for Mullard GZ34/5AR4 rectifiers with the F31B date codes etched in glass, not F32B.
Fat Base Mullard GZ34 is wonderful, a bit pricey but well worth it.
The metal base GZ34's are hideously expensive now but have a bit more punch.
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Emil,
Parts Connexion has grade A black treasure 300b on sale for $224.95.
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Emil,
Parts Connexion has grade A black treasure 300b on sale for $224.95.
Link to the sale page - http://www.partsconnexion.com/t/eblast/2017/ny/ny.html
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Emil,
Parts Connexion has grade A black treasure 300b on sale for $224.95.
Thanks Joe. I'll check them out.
What have you heard about them? Better than Gold Lion ?
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Emil, I personally haven't heard either of them. Some people on
Audiogon say the BT's are very nice!
Sorry I couldn't help you more.
Joe
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I had a quad of black treasure 300B a few years ago, excellent. I use Gold Lion KT88s now, also excellent. Another +1 for Jim McShane.