Author Topic: Speaker Set Up  (Read 8912 times)

Offline rollo

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Speaker Set Up
« on: November 15, 2022, 10:56:01 AM »
  A different Started 1/3 from rear wall. Then picked distance from chair to speaker . Choose 9ft. Placed speakers 83% apart  [ center line of tweeters] of distance from speaker to chair. No equilateral triangle this time. Huge difference. Picked up body and weight. Who knew ? 


charles


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Offline GDHAL

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Re: Speaker Set Up
« Reply #1 on: November 15, 2022, 11:44:14 AM »
Hey Charles. No equilateral triangle for me either. So, in answer to your question, I knew!

Glad you found your sweet spot.

In my case, plane of speaker drivers are set apart 88 inches from each other and form an isosceles triangle. Speakers are toed-in creating a PLP just inside the speakers axes (i.e. speakers axes is at the back of the head).
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Offline rollo

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Re: Speaker Set Up
« Reply #2 on: November 15, 2022, 12:35:14 PM »
  It was starting from the listening chair instead of dividing room into thirds. I have set many a system. This method taught me something new.

charles
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Offline Nick B

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Re: Speaker Set Up
« Reply #3 on: November 15, 2022, 02:50:14 PM »
Good info for me when moving into my new place. I think I saw a video by Ron Vedder? on the one thirds methodology.
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Offline rollo

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Re: Speaker Set Up
« Reply #4 on: November 17, 2022, 11:40:57 AM »
  Actually the formula is from Jim Smith. We think alike. Was doing same but never realized it. Starting from the listening chair made the difference.

charles
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Offline DRN

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Re: Speaker Set Up
« Reply #5 on: December 20, 2022, 11:29:18 AM »
Room here is 12'X16' setup is to the 3rds. I have the Fritz Carrera Be's very important to have good stands.
My Sound Anchors just came in (heavy 37lbs and stable) made a very very nice difference top to bottom. Treat the room!
I hear no booming bass, or brightness from the Be tweeters. None.
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Offline Nick B

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Re: Speaker Set Up
« Reply #6 on: December 20, 2022, 11:55:12 AM »
Room here is 12'X16' setup is to the 3rds. I have the Fritz Carrera Be's very important to have good stands.
My Sound Anchors just came in (heavy 37lbs and stable) made a very very nice difference top to bottom. Treat the room!
I hear no booming bass, or brightness from the Be tweeters. None.

I have the Carreras. A great speaker. I will be trying out speakers with the AMT tweeters soon…should be interesting
Orchard Starkrimson Ultra amp
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Roon, Tidal, Qobuz
PI Audio UberBUSS

Offline GDHAL

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Re: Speaker Set Up
« Reply #7 on: December 20, 2022, 01:05:21 PM »
..........
a big room gives a really significant head start in getting good sound from an audio playback system.
doug s.

True. However, even when "big" one must be mindful of the *same* dimensions and *firing the speakers* the wrong way.

Example (strictly hypothetical): A 40' x 40' x 40' room is way larger (cubic footage) than 35'L x 27'W x 13'H, but all else equal, the former will sound horrible compared to the latter. Also, in the case of 35' x 27' x 13', if the speakers are set up along the 35' dimension firing toward the 27' dimension, that will not be nearly as good (sonically, having nothing to do with "aesthetics") as setting up the speakers along the 27' dimension and firing toward the 35' dimension.

Best.

Hal
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Offline GDHAL

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Re: Speaker Set Up
« Reply #8 on: December 20, 2022, 01:10:56 PM »
I have the Carreras. A great speaker. I will be trying out speakers with the AMT tweeters soon…should be interesting

Yes, it should be interesting. My TRef's have AMT (which GE coins "HVFR") tweeters. I can say/write without a doubt they are excellent. Yeah I know, not like a super high sensitive horn, but.... Also, according to Sandy Gross, the only "better" tweeter is a plasma tweeter.

An excerpt from stereophile mag:

....But when the patents ran out on Dr. Heil's Air Motion Transformer, a whole slew of inspired speaker-makers were quickly up and running with their own variations, more than happy to adopt the AMT's smoother, more softly detailed elegance. Sandy Gross has made the AMT technology the axis mundi of his GoldenEar line. In fact, GoldenEar's HVFR tweeter may be the most important ingredient in the Triton's overall sound character.
« Last Edit: December 20, 2022, 01:12:51 PM by GDHAL »
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Offline rollo

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Re: Speaker Set Up
« Reply #9 on: December 21, 2022, 11:08:39 AM »
Room here is 12'X16' setup is to the 3rds. I have the Fritz Carrera Be's very important to have good stands.
My Sound Anchors just came in (heavy 37lbs and stable) made a very very nice difference top to bottom. Treat the room!
I hear no booming bass, or brightness from the Be tweeters. None.

  We demo the Fritz in a 12' wide room as well. Play with distance to side walls. We like about 7' from center of driver. Better stands matter. Enjoy !!

charles
contact me  at rollo14@verizon.net or visit us on Facebook
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Offline GDHAL

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Re: Speaker Set Up
« Reply #10 on: December 21, 2022, 11:35:14 AM »
re: what charlie said about distance to side walls, i've found that in smaller rooms a slight difference in dimension from speaker to sidewall gives good results, as it tends to reduce room node issues.  ie: instead of having the center of each driver 2.5' from each side wall, have one 2.25' away, and the other 2.75' away.  it's worth experimenting.

and, re: better stands, the sound anchor stands are excellent, imo.

doug s.


Hi Doug. Your assertion (quoted above) is interesting. I can understand how that half foot or so could affect room node issues. Positively or negatively I wouldn't know as I have never tried that.

So let me ask you, would that speaker arrangement that you're suggesting be with the same toe in towards the listener (or not the same toe in)? Where is the PLP in that configuration?

Best

Hal
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Offline GDHAL

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Re: Speaker Set Up
« Reply #11 on: December 21, 2022, 12:24:22 PM »
Thank you, Doug. Very appreciative of your insight (and rather prompt reply to my post too for that matter).

In my particular case, I wouldn't sit anywhere except dead center to the room, for aesthetic reasons (plus in my case I have a video setup which is part of the audio setup). Also in my case, my speakers weigh over 100 pounds each, so repositioning them even a half foot really does become a big deal.

And your point about toe in/out (or straight) is also true. In my case, I found that the intersection axis point of the speaker setup is best when it's about 4 inches behind my head. Hence my speaker arrangement is technically an isosceles triangle as opposed to an equilateral. The arrangement that I have follows Sandy Gross's setup tips,  plus my own experimentation when I initially did the setup, as well as what certain other audiophiles do.

However, I have what I call a "secondary primary listening position" (I know, an oxymoron), where I can set up a bar stool chair (and the eggnog is flowing right now) basically a foot and a half behind my primary listening position. That puts the listener about 6 to 12 inches *behind* the speaker axis convergence point.

I've listened from both front and behind-axis convergence positions and prefer to be inside (front) of the axis as opposed to being outside (behind) of it. However, I do understand how this is strictly a matter of preference and not "better" or "worse" per se.

I'll add that in general, I think (and again this is only my thinking) that most audiophiles have a *near-field* listening situation, even though they think that they don't. And I know what "near field" means (based on dozens of google articles, other reading references, Paul McGowan, etc.). If one stays within the concept of the near field having to do with more speakers, and less of the room itself, I believe sitting inside the speaker axis convergence helps achieve that. Conversely, when a person sits outside of the speaker axis convergence point, I believe the sound now starts to become far-field, essentially inviting more room interaction. Besides that, near-field allows one to play at a louder SPL without disturbing others. The aforementioned is only my opinion. I have no scientific data to back any of that up. Just my own personal experience having listened to many (40?) different systems in many different rooms.

EDIT: I have to get out of the habit of making posts from my cell phone while on the road as opposed to sitting down at my desktop computer.  :lol:

EDIT 2: I'm home and made this edit 6 PM EST on 12/21/22. Hopefully my last edit to this post!  :lol:
« Last Edit: December 21, 2022, 02:59:22 PM by GDHAL »
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Offline GDHAL

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Re: Speaker Set Up
« Reply #12 on: December 21, 2022, 06:07:10 PM »
An excerpt from Bob Harley on speaker placement. It's a quick read.

https://www.theabsolutesound.com/articles/optimizing-the-soundstage-with-speaker-placement
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