Author Topic: OK, WTF am I doing wrong  (Read 8429 times)

Offline P.I.

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Re: OK, WTF am I doing wrong
« Reply #15 on: June 23, 2022, 01:06:38 PM »
I got the Bravia in 2010 but have just found out it is a 2009 model. After an hour and a half with Sony we figured out that while the KDL-52W5100 does have an optical output, it doesn't have a choice of PCM or Dolby. That means it can only be hooked up to an AV receiver that can split it to either. So, I can either get an AV receiver that has audio out jacks (to go to the pre) and will work with the Bravia, just forget the whole thing or spend big bucks to get a new tele that will work with the dac (PCM). Ain't that some s%&t.
Ahhhhh... Good to see that you figured it out. FWIW:  I personally think that Toslink is THE WORST digital connection option.

Years ago I attended a demonstration showing why.  The guy running the emo took a Toslink connection and basically waded it up into a loose ball. Then he played a track and while the track was playing released the ball and objects in the sounstage moved to slightly different positions.  Then he swapped out the plastic link to one made from AT&T glass fiber.  The AT&T sounded much better and was not subject to the same problem. Light scatter in a Toslink is a big, bad deal.  Do you not have another digital output option on the Bravia?
« Last Edit: June 23, 2022, 01:44:34 PM by P.I. »
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Offline _Scotty_

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Re: OK, WTF am I doing wrong
« Reply #16 on: June 23, 2022, 04:13:52 PM »
It figures that at that point in time that not all TVs wouldn't have the option of
a choice between stereo PCM output and multi-channel Dolby Digital output.
 I listen to TV via glass fiber toslink running into my DAC and when watching
Blu-ray I switch to another toslink of the same construction running from the Blu-ray
player. Somewhat cumbersome but it works for me.
Scotty

Offline dflee

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Re: OK, WTF am I doing wrong
« Reply #17 on: June 23, 2022, 06:43:47 PM »
I paid over three and a half grand for it and picture wise it is great. But every time I look at it now it just makes me feel bad. I got an IFI bluetooth for my wife's Ipad and have it running through the pre and can't believe how well it sounds with her books and music. Just wanted to get better out of the tele. Oh well.
I might see what the audio store I got it from would do for me on a new one and maybe even take the old one in trade.

Don
"Enjoy pleasure, not because it is fleeting, but because it exists at all." Sacrament, Clive Barker.

Offline Nick B

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Re: OK, WTF am I doing wrong
« Reply #18 on: June 23, 2022, 09:52:49 PM »
I got the Bravia in 2010 but have just found out it is a 2009 model. After an hour and a half with Sony we figured out that while the KDL-52W5100 does have an optical output, it doesn't have a choice of PCM or Dolby. That means it can only be hooked up to an AV receiver that can split it to either. So, I can either get an AV receiver that has audio out jacks (to go to the pre) and will work with the Bravia, just forget the whole thing or spend big bucks to get a new tele that will work with the dac (PCM). Ain't that some s%&t.

Is it possible there is a small standalone device that would have the same capability as an AV receiver?
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Offline P.I.

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Re: OK, WTF am I doing wrong
« Reply #19 on: June 24, 2022, 09:49:21 AM »
I got the Bravia in 2010 but have just found out it is a 2009 model. After an hour and a half with Sony we figured out that while the KDL-52W5100 does have an optical output, it doesn't have a choice of PCM or Dolby. That means it can only be hooked up to an AV receiver that can split it to either. So, I can either get an AV receiver that has audio out jacks (to go to the pre) and will work with the Bravia, just forget the whole thing or spend big bucks to get a new tele that will work with the dac (PCM). Ain't that some s%&t.

Is it possible there is a small standalone device that would have the same capability as an AV receiver?
Maybe this?

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07G5NQCK7?aaxitk=53f8c84352c44c3bca3814cedb8ed04a&pd_rd_plhdr=t&ref=dacx_dp_581953391062836218_579259607273381754
« Last Edit: June 24, 2022, 09:51:17 AM by P.I. »
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Offline dflee

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Re: OK, WTF am I doing wrong
« Reply #20 on: June 24, 2022, 01:49:20 PM »
Dave:
You are a genius even when your wrong! The item you posted is just an extender. It can take a lot of different signals and extend them but can't separate or change them. BUT, after talking to J-Tech they do have a unit that can take the multiple signal and convert to analog. It has it's own dac internally and I'm not sure how well it works but for 75 bucks I gotta try. It's a JTech-DTOA-D. It has an optical input. I'm not very well versed at understanding specs so if any of you do look this unit up, let me know if it sounds like it's got good innards.

Don
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Offline Nick B

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Re: OK, WTF am I doing wrong
« Reply #21 on: June 24, 2022, 01:52:58 PM »
Don,

I had a hunch you’d be calling J-Tech and following up on this. That would be one heck of an easy solution.
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Offline P.I.

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Re: OK, WTF am I doing wrong
« Reply #22 on: June 24, 2022, 09:18:58 PM »
Dave:
You are a genius even when your wrong! The item you posted is just an extender. It can take a lot of different signals and extend them but can't separate or change them. BUT, after talking to J-Tech they do have a unit that can take the multiple signal and convert to analog. It has it's own dac internally and I'm not sure how well it works but for 75 bucks I gotta try. It's a JTech-DTOA-D. It has an optical input. I'm not very well versed at understanding specs so if any of you do look this unit up, let me know if it sounds like it's got good innards.

Don
l am absolutely stupid about digital outs on TV's, so I just did a search for something that looked right.  I'm happy it was a nudge towards a solution!  :thumb:
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Offline tmazz

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Re: OK, WTF am I doing wrong
« Reply #23 on: June 24, 2022, 10:32:52 PM »
Don here is my concern with that unit, if it simply takes the optical output and converts it to analog I'm not sure it will solve your problem. What you were running into was that the TV was sending out a multi channel surround sound signal over the optical out and your DAC could only speak 2 channel stereo. If this unit converts the optical into 6 channels of surround (RF. C, LF, RR, LR & SW) I'm not sure if that will be a usable output if you are trying to listen to TV  audio using a 2 channel stereo system. One first instinct would be to hook up the left and right front channels to the stereo, but most surround sound mixes route almost all of the on screen dialog to the center channel so is sounds as if it is coming out of the spot (the screen) where you see the people talking. If you only play the left and right front channels through the stereo you will be missing most of the dialog. What you really need is something that can take a 5.1 signal and mix it down to 2 channel stereo so you don't end up missing any of the audio in the surround mix. Hopefully the unit you are looking at is capable of doing a 5.1 to 2.0 conversion. If not I don't think it will be a viable option.

I hope it works out for you.

Tom
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Offline dflee

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Re: OK, WTF am I doing wrong
« Reply #24 on: June 25, 2022, 02:53:39 PM »
Hey Tom:
Thanks for the input. The tele is only dolby digital and the Jtech unit has only a right and left output.
I just hope the dac is good enough for a decent sound. I really am blown away how well the IFI bluetooth receiver dac sounds with my wife's Ipad. We shall see.

Don
"Enjoy pleasure, not because it is fleeting, but because it exists at all." Sacrament, Clive Barker.

Offline tmazz

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Re: OK, WTF am I doing wrong
« Reply #25 on: June 25, 2022, 09:09:08 PM »
That's good Don, it looks like that unit will do the 5.1 to 2.0 conversion for you.

I bought one of those iFi Zen Bluetooth units for my son last year and I was very impressed by it as well. The also have an excellent USB DAC in the same line. I know I guy who bought one of them as an upgrade from the $5k PS Audio Perfectwave DAC that he owned. Yeah it's limited in that it only has a single digital input and that is USB, but if you can deal with that (as most of us who use a Roon endpoint can) its pretty amazing  that at least one guy thought tat the sub $200 iFi DAC outperformed a $5,000 unit.
Remember, it's all about the music........

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Offline dflee

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Re: OK, WTF am I doing wrong
« Reply #26 on: June 29, 2022, 06:17:19 PM »
Well, it just keeps gettin better and better.
Got the JTech in today. Hooked up, put on the head phones and good news, bad news.
Does the unit improve the sound, absolutely. Bottom end is better. Quieter, without a doubt. Background noise has diminished by a noticeable amount. BUT the sound has gone down by quite a noticeable amount. The cable box and the IFI Zen receiver is as close to the same as you can get but the JTech unit is quite a bit lower in output. I have to go up say from five o'clock to almost eight o’clock on the dial. Wife hates that. So now gotta figure out where to go next. Get the same volume from the tele as the cable box.
Any suggestions would be great.

Don
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Offline P.I.

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Re: OK, WTF am I doing wrong
« Reply #27 on: June 29, 2022, 06:34:43 PM »
Well, it just keeps gettin better and better.
Got the JTech in today. Hooked up, put on the head phones and good news, bad news.
Does the unit improve the sound, absolutely. Bottom end is better. Quieter, without a doubt. Background noise has diminished by a noticeable amount. BUT the sound has gone down by quite a noticeable amount. The cable box and the IFI Zen receiver is as close to the same as you can get but the JTech unit is quite a bit lower in output. I have to go up say from five o'clock to almost eight o’clock on the dial. Wife hates that. So now gotta figure out where to go next. Get the same volume from the tele as the cable box.
Any suggestions would be great.

Don
Move the knob.
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Offline tmazz

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Re: OK, WTF am I doing wrong
« Reply #28 on: June 29, 2022, 09:20:17 PM »
Don I have the same issue with different inputs that al go through a single HT Rcvr. The DVD player is a different volume level than the cable box . And even within the cable there is a difference in the volume level between watching a show in real time and watching it recorded on the DVR.

Unfortunately I think Dave has the right idea. Get used to moving the knob.

Remember, it's all about the music........

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Offline Nick B

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Re: OK, WTF am I doing wrong
« Reply #29 on: June 30, 2022, 12:36:00 AM »
Well, it just keeps gettin better and better.
Got the JTech in today. Hooked up, put on the head phones and good news, bad news.
Does the unit improve the sound, absolutely. Bottom end is better. Quieter, without a doubt. Background noise has diminished by a noticeable amount. BUT the sound has gone down by quite a noticeable amount. The cable box and the IFI Zen receiver is as close to the same as you can get but the JTech unit is quite a bit lower in output. I have to go up say from five o'clock to almost eight o’clock on  :thumb:the dial. Wife hates that. So now gotta figure out where to go next. Get the same volume from the tele as the cable box.
Any suggestions would be great.

Don

Don,

Think of where you started with this and be quite grateful that you have arrived with this good result for $75 or so. AN gave you an inexpensive solution and I would just get used to cranking up that knob just a bit more and enjoying it  :thumb:

Orchard Starkrimson Ultra amp
Hattor Big preamp
JMR Voce Grande speakers
Holo Cyan2 dac
Holo Red streamer
Hapa Aero digital coax
WyWires Silver cables
TWL Digital American II p cord
Audio Envy p cords
Roon, Tidal, Qobuz
PI Audio UberBUSS