Author Topic: Rollin, rollin, rollin,  (Read 17612 times)

Offline jimbones

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Rollin, rollin, rollin,
« on: December 23, 2015, 08:31:56 AM »
So over the past 3 years I have nearly replaced everything in my system. I have a tube pre and I should keep good NOS back up tubes. Whats a man to do? TUBE ROLLIN!! I'm scouring the internet to figure out what type 6SN7 to buy. It can make a man crazy! Leaning towards a TungSol from the 1950's 6SN7GT White Label. 
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Offline Triode Pete

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Re: Rollin, rollin, rollin,
« Reply #1 on: December 23, 2015, 08:44:51 AM »
So over the past 3 years I have nearly replaced everything in my system. I have a tube pre and I should keep good NOS back up tubes. Whats a man to do? TUBE ROLLIN!! I'm scouring the internet to figure out what type 6SN7 to buy. It can make a man crazy! Leaning towards a TungSol from the 1950's 6SN7GT White Label. 


Jim-bo,
You want to lose your mind??? I have ~ 15 MATCHED pairs of vintage 6SN7GT's you can try... Mainly all USA-made with a British Brimar pair mixed in...

Also, I can give you a copy of VTV 6SN7 shoot-out with comments & ratings... That will surely put you over the edge!

Happy Nervosa!
Pete
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Offline jimbones

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Re: Rollin, rollin, rollin,
« Reply #2 on: December 23, 2015, 09:16:37 AM »
So over the past 3 years I have nearly replaced everything in my system. I have a tube pre and I should keep good NOS back up tubes. Whats a man to do? TUBE ROLLIN!! I'm scouring the internet to figure out what type 6SN7 to buy. It can make a man crazy! Leaning towards a TungSol from the 1950's 6SN7GT White Label. 

[/quote

Jim-bo,
You want to lose your mind??? I have ~ 15 MATCHED pairs of vintage 6SN7GT's you can try... Mainly all USA-made with a British Brimar pair mixed in...

Also, I can give you a copy of VTV 6SN7 shoot-out with comments & ratings... That will surely put you over the edge!

Happy Nervosa!
Pete

Well it sounds like you can help cure my nervosa. I'd love to try them. I'll message you. Thanks Pete.
Modwright LS 100 Pre, KWA 100SE Pwr Amp, VPI Classic II/BenzMicro Glider, Open Aire Aktiv OB Speakers, Velodyne HGS12, Emotiva ERC-3 CDP, Burson Conductor DAC, DH Labs, Wywires, PS Audio, Ultrafi USB, TWL, PS Audio PPP

Offline Putz

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Re: Rollin, rollin, rollin,
« Reply #3 on: December 23, 2015, 09:25:00 AM »
I have a Belles 22A preamp that uses 2 12AU7s. I believe they currently have vintage RCA 5963 tubes installed.

3 questions

Are the RCAs good tubes?

What other tubes would you recommend for rolling?

What's the lifespan on these tubes? I leave the preamp on a lot and I'm concerned about wearing out the tubes.

Offline richidoo

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Re: Rollin, rollin, rollin,
« Reply #4 on: December 23, 2015, 10:07:14 AM »
Well it sounds like you can help cure my nervosa.

More like pouring on gasoline!   :rofl:


I have a Belles 22A preamp that uses 2 12AU7s. I believe they currently have vintage RCA 5963 tubes installed.

3 questions

Are the RCAs good tubes?

What other tubes would you recommend for rolling?

What's the lifespan on these tubes? I leave the preamp on a lot and I'm concerned about wearing out the tubes.

Genelex Gold Lion 12AU7 would be my first choice for new production tubes.

Belles 21 is an all-tube preamp that came with lousy "Dayton" output caps. The 22 is solid state output stage, but you should check if there are any lousy coupling caps in the circuit. Upgrading those would yield bigger improvement than rolling tubes.

The tube life depends on how hard it's used. Belles is not hard on tubes. You should expect 5000+ hours with good quality new tubes with typical B+ and bias current. 2 decades of light use, or a couple years of always on. You'll hear when they get old, it sounds wimpy, syrupy, soft, or harsh and lots harmonic distortion like ringing.

RCA made excellent quality tubes. They tend toward slightly warm sounding, very musical, classic vintage tone. Not as syrupy as Amperex or lesser extent Mullard, but usually not as detailed and clean sounding as most current production tubes or vintage Telefunken. But there are some RCA variants like "cleartop" that are more detailed, at expense of less bass. I have a pair of these (Black Sable cryo from tube depot) that I'll probably never use, if you want to try them. With your solid state output stage to support the bass they might be good, idk. Shuguang 12au7 is very inexpensive and very clear, clean, good extension, full tone, but probably not as refined as the Genelex.
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Offline Putz

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Re: Rollin, rollin, rollin,
« Reply #5 on: December 23, 2015, 12:30:05 PM »
How do I check if there are any lousy coupling caps in the circuit.

Don't want to open up the preamp. Here's a pick of the RCA tube box. Any way to tell which one it is?

Would love to try your cleartops.

Offline jimbones

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Re: Rollin, rollin, rollin,
« Reply #6 on: December 23, 2015, 12:30:35 PM »
Well, the plan is not to demo all 15 pairs. i would limit it to 3 pairs.
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Offline richidoo

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Re: Rollin, rollin, rollin,
« Reply #7 on: December 23, 2015, 01:00:43 PM »
Look on the top of the RCA box for the tube info. Best place to look is on the tube. You may have to look very carefully for the worn designation.

The top Belles Statement VT-01 preamp review on Dagogo shows the Dayton film output caps still being used in 2011 version. But it has tube output stage like 21A. If you have cooling slots in the cover you can peer inside with a flashlight. They are large black with yellow caps. They are inexpensive and maybe Dave Belles likes them in the same way I like $6 Shuguang 12AU7s.  :rofl:  Carlman had a great improvement when he replaced his with Roederstein caps.    Hometheaterdoc used 22A for a while, he did a lot of tube rolling, maybe he'll chime in.

PM your address. I'll try to dig them up! You'll have to open the preamp to change the tubes.  :-P
« Last Edit: December 23, 2015, 01:10:32 PM by richidoo »
"I don't care much about music. What I like is sounds." - Dizzy Gillespie  (Audiophile or Liar?)

Offline Putz

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Re: Rollin, rollin, rollin,
« Reply #8 on: December 23, 2015, 01:31:05 PM »
Top of box has R-CB 5 (1-49). Not pulling the amp apart at this point.

Hometheaterdoc originally sold this amp back in 2012. I am the second owner. I got his blessing before I bought it on Agon.

I'll pm you and check out the caps when I change tubes. Karl Tam could change the Caps for me if necessary. I don't solder and I'm assuming that's needed. Karl recapped my Classe amp not that long ago.

Offline Triode Pete

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Re: Rollin, rollin, rollin,
« Reply #9 on: December 23, 2015, 03:28:40 PM »
Well, the plan is not to demo all 15 pairs. i would limit it to 3 pairs.

Chicken!
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Offline richidoo

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Re: Rollin, rollin, rollin,
« Reply #10 on: December 23, 2015, 04:40:07 PM »
Cool! Good to know it's still in the "extended family."

Snap a pic of the preamp when you have it open. You'll refer to it often once you start thinking about mods. It's very easy to mod.
"I don't care much about music. What I like is sounds." - Dizzy Gillespie  (Audiophile or Liar?)

Offline jimbones

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Re: Rollin, rollin, rollin,
« Reply #11 on: December 23, 2015, 05:55:42 PM »
bock, bock, bock
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Offline Putz

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Re: Rollin, rollin, rollin,
« Reply #12 on: December 23, 2015, 06:18:43 PM »
I don't know why, but suddenly I'm getting a craving to spin some Frankie Laine.

Offline shadowlight

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Re: Rollin, rollin, rollin,
« Reply #13 on: December 24, 2015, 07:23:53 AM »
Paul,

I think I have a bunch of 12au7 including some clear tops if you want to try them.  I am around all next week if you want to stop by and pick them up.

Offline richidoo

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Re: Rollin, rollin, rollin,
« Reply #14 on: December 24, 2015, 11:44:25 AM »
Let me know if you want me to hold the ship.
"I don't care much about music. What I like is sounds." - Dizzy Gillespie  (Audiophile or Liar?)